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jamie
July 16th, 2017, 02:26 PM
"James, a bondservant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad" (James 1:1)


Most Holy Father, we know and from the chronicles and books of the ancients we find that among other famous nations our own, the Scots, has been graced with widespread renown. It journeyed from Greater Scythia by way of the Tyrrhenian Sea and the Pillars of Hercules, and dwelt for a long course of time in Spain among the most savage peoples, but nowhere could it be subdued by any people, however barbarous. Thence it came, twelve hundred years after the people of Israel crossed the Red Sea, to its home in the west where it still lives today. The Britons it first drove out, the Picts it utterly destroyed, and, even though very often assailed by the Norwegians, the Danes and the English, it took possession of that home with many victories and untold efforts; and, as the histories of old time bear witness, they have held it free of all servitude ever since. In their kingdom there have reigned one hundred and thirteen kings of their own royal stock, the line unbroken by a single foreigner.

The high qualities and merits of these people, were they not otherwise manifest, shine forth clearly enough from this: that the King of kings and Lord of lords, our Lord Jesus Christ, after His Passion and Resurrection, called them, even though settled in the uttermost parts of the earth, almost the first to His most holy faith. Nor did He wish them to be confirmed in that faith by merely anyone but by the first of His Apostles - by calling, though second or third in rank - the most gentle Saint Andrew, the Blessed Peterís brother, and desired him to keep them under his protection as their patron for ever.
(http://webarchive.nrscotland.gov.uk/20170106021747/http://www.nas.gov.uk/downloads/declarationArbroath.pdf)

jamie
July 16th, 2017, 09:36 PM
The Scots are part of Ephraim, one of the lost sheep of the House of Israel.

steko
July 16th, 2017, 10:29 PM
"British Israelism" :down:

chair
July 16th, 2017, 10:49 PM
Everybody wants to be the Jews. But when it comes to real Jews- they hate them.

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 03:20 AM
It does not matter about BLOOD RELATIONS to anyone.

Luke 8:20 So he was told, "Your mother and your brothers are standing outside, wanting to see you."

21 But he replied to them, "My mother and my brothers are those who hear the word of God and do it."


Luke 11:27 As he said these things, a woman in the crowd spoke out to him, "Blessed is the womb that bore you and the breasts at which you nursed!"

28 But he replied, "Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and obey it!"

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 03:21 AM
Everybody wants to be the Jews. But when it comes to real Jews- they hate them.

Unbelievable that anyone could say what you just did.

iamaberean
July 17th, 2017, 03:29 AM
Everybody wants to be the Jews. But when it comes to real Jews- they hate them.

All Jews are of Israel but all of Israel are not Jews.
Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Jesus was not speaking of Jews here.
Lost sheep of the house of Israel spoke of the tribes that had lived in northern Israel prior to being captured by the Assyrians and taken out of their land.

chair
July 17th, 2017, 03:41 AM
Unbelievable that anyone could says what you just did.
First of all: Believe! I just said it.
Secondly, it's true.
Christians want to be the True Jews (TM). But they hate the real Jews.

chair
July 17th, 2017, 03:43 AM
All Jews are of Israel but all of Israel are not Jews.
Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Jesus was not speaking of Jews here.
Lost sheep of the house of Israel spoke of the tribes that had lived in northern Israel prior to being captured by the Assyrians and taken out of their land.

Not Gentiles. OK.
Not Samaritans. OK.
Rather" "House of Israel". So who is this supposed to be? Gentiles?- can't be. He just said not gentiles.

iamaberean
July 17th, 2017, 03:54 AM
Not Gentiles. OK.
Not Samaritans. OK.
Rather" "House of Israel". So who is this supposed to be? Gentiles?- can't be. He just said not gentiles.

Lost sheep of the house of Israel spoke of the tribes that had lived in northern Israel prior to being captured by the Assyrians and taken out of their land. They were lost because, for the most part, they had not been in the land of Israel when Jesus came. The disciples knew where that were and they followed their path all the way to Britain. Paul was the only disciple that was told to go unto the Gentiles and he even wound up with the others later.

iamaberean
July 17th, 2017, 04:10 AM
Rom 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
Rom 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

All Israel includes the house of Israel and Jews.

chair
July 17th, 2017, 04:11 AM
Lost sheep of the house of Israel spoke of the tribes that had lived in northern Israel prior to being captured by the Assyrians and taken out of their land. They were lost because, for the most part, they had not been in the land of Israel when Jesus came. The disciples knew where that were and they followed their path all the way to Britain. Paul was the only disciple that was told to go unto the Gentiles and he even wound up with the others later.

I suspect there isn't anything I can say that will get you to abandon this theory. If you believe this, you are beyond logical argument.

popsthebuilder
July 17th, 2017, 05:30 AM
First of all: Believe! I just said it.
Secondly, it's true.
Christians want to be the True Jews (TM). But they hate the real Jews.
Then they aren't true Christians but wolves in sheep's clothing.

Sent from my Z983 using Tapatalk

jamie
July 17th, 2017, 09:39 AM
"British Israelism" :down:


Who are the nation and company of nations in the context of Israel?

jamie
July 17th, 2017, 09:44 AM
"British Israelism" :down:

An excerpt from "Recessional" by Rudyard Kipling:


If, drunk with sight of power, we loose
Wild tongues that have not Thee in awe,
Such boastings as the Gentiles use,
Or lesser breeds without the Law—
Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,
Lest we forget—lest we forget!

For heathen heart that puts her trust
In reeking tube and iron shard,
All valiant dust that builds on dust,
And guarding, calls not Thee to guard,
For frantic boast and foolish word—
Thy mercy on Thy People, Lord!

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 10:07 AM
First of all: Believe! I just said it.
Secondly, it's true.
Christians want to be the True Jews (TM). But they hate the real Jews.

Pathetic. Sounds like you have some problems with a type of idol worship going on with you.

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 10:10 AM
Lost sheep of the house of Israel spoke of the tribes that had lived in northern Israel prior to being captured by the Assyrians and taken out of their land. They were lost because, for the most part, they had not been in the land of Israel when Jesus came. The disciples knew where that were and they followed their path all the way to Britain. Paul was the only disciple that was told to go unto the Gentiles and he even wound up with the others later.

The lost sheep of Israel are the Jews Jesus spoke to.

They were called sheep because they were already God's.

They were lost because they did not have an appropriate shepherd to lead them.

John 17:6 "I have revealed you to those whom you gave me out of the world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your word.

Matthew 15:24 He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel."

Ezekiel 34:5 They were scattered for lack of a shepherd, and they became food for every beast of the field and were scattered. 6 My flock wandered through all the mountains and on every high hill; My flock was scattered over all the surface of the earth, and there was no one to search or seek for them.”’”

7 Therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: 8 “As I live,” declares the Lord God, “surely because My flock has become a prey, My flock has even become food for all the beasts of the field for lack of a shepherd, and My shepherds did not search for My flock, but rather the shepherds fed themselves and did not feed My flock; 9 therefore, you shepherds, hear the word of the Lord: 10 ‘Thus says the Lord God, “Behold, I am against the shepherds, and I will demand My sheep from them and make them cease from feeding sheep. So the shepherds will not feed themselves anymore, but I will deliver My flock from their mouth, so that they will not be food for them.”’”

Tambora
July 17th, 2017, 10:12 AM
"British Israelism" :down:Yes it is.
Built on exaggeration and falsehood.

steko
July 17th, 2017, 10:38 AM
First of all: Believe! I just said it.
Secondly, it's true.
Christians want to be the True Jews (TM). But they hate the real Jews.

Not all Christians.

steko
July 17th, 2017, 10:41 AM
Everybody wants to be the Jews. But when it comes to real Jews- they hate them.

Not everybody.

steko
July 17th, 2017, 10:44 AM
Unbelievable that anyone could say what you just did.

You don't know history very well, do you.

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 10:52 AM
You don't know history very well, do you.

You just tried to straighten chair out for saying what he/she did, and now you don't like it that I too went against what he/she said?

What about history would you like to talk about?

I gave scripture that proves you are wrong about the sheep, about the lost sheep, and about the restoration.

What don't people get about only Jesus' shed blood mattering?

Not even his blood relations matter.

Tambora
July 17th, 2017, 11:02 AM
The Scots are part of Ephraim, one of the lost sheep of the House of Israel.The Scots, as was most of Europe, are descendants of Japheth, not Shem.

chair
July 17th, 2017, 11:20 AM
Not all Christians.

True. I apologize for generalizing.

steko
July 17th, 2017, 11:25 AM
True. I apologize for generalizing.

:cheers:

steko
July 17th, 2017, 11:29 AM
You just tried to straighten chair out for saying what he/she did, and now you don't like it that I too went against what he/she said?

Different points


What about history would you like to talk about?


None.


I gave scripture that proves you are wrong about the sheep, about the lost sheep, and about the restoration.

What don't people get about only Jesus' shed blood mattering?

Not even his blood relations matter.

Only in your head.

jamie
July 17th, 2017, 12:08 PM
The Scots, as was most of Europe, are descendants of Japheth, not Shem.


So who are the nation and company of nations?

"So He called his name Israel. Also God said to him: 'I am God Almighty. Be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall proceed from you, and kings shall come from your body." (Genesis 35:10-11)

Danoh
July 17th, 2017, 01:39 PM
So who are the nation and company of nations?

"So He called his name Israel. Also God said to him: 'I am God Almighty. Be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall proceed from you, and kings shall come from your body." (Genesis 35:10-11)

A further expansion on what was meant when that was first said prior to Jacob...

24 tribes plus two...and each with their Prince.

12 in Ishmael.

12 in Isaac.

2 in Joseph.

All Semitic.

Case in point as to just one of those...

Genesis 17:20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.

Genesis 25:16 These are the sons of Ishmael, and these are their names, by their towns, and by their castles; twelve princes according to their nations.

Rom. 5:8
Acts 17:11,12

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 02:31 PM
Different points



None.

.

Only in your head.

Who is Jesus' mother, brother, and sister? Who is Jesus' disciple, and who is his friend? Who is his child?

Explain to me WHAT blood relations matter then? Tell me what Jew matters? A Jew who doesn't even believe in God at all? Yeah right, no.
Not every Jew matters to God. The only Jew who matters to God is a Jew who comes to Him through Jesus, and they have to do it before He comes again, or it is too late. Same for Greeks, Gentiles, everyone.

jamie
July 17th, 2017, 02:32 PM
Case in point as to just one of those...


The topic is about the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Who are you saying are the nation and company of nations from the man Israel?

God's Truth
July 17th, 2017, 02:36 PM
A further expansion on what was meant when that was first said prior to Jacob...

24 tribes plus two...and each with their Prince.

12 in Ishmael.

12 in Isaac.

2 in Joseph.

All Semitic.

Case in point as to just one of those...

Genesis 17:20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation.

Genesis 25:16 These are the sons of Ishmael, and these are their names, by their towns, and by their castles; twelve princes according to their nations.

Rom. 5:8
Acts 17:11,12

Paul says to stop with the genealogies. Stop with thinking about who is related to which Jew.

It does NOT matter.

1 Timothy 1:4 or to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies. Such things promote controversial speculations rather than advancing God's work--which is by faith.

WHICH IS BY FAITH.

Which is by faith means it does NOT matter about to whom we are blood related it only matters about those who have faith in Jesus' blood cleaning them of the sins they repent of doing.

jamie
July 17th, 2017, 02:43 PM
Yes it is.
Built on exaggeration and falsehood.


Who are Israel's nation and company of nations?

iamaberean
July 18th, 2017, 03:06 AM
The lost sheep of Israel are the Jews Jesus spoke to.
No they are not!

They were called sheep because they were already God's.
Yes, you are right here.

They were lost because they did not have an appropriate shepherd to lead them.
This is because they had gone a whoring after other gods.

Matthew 15:24 He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel."
You have misquoted scripture,
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
The house of Israel was referring to those that had lived in northern Israel before their capture.

Jesus spent his time here on earth instructing those who lived in the area, Jews.

chair
July 18th, 2017, 05:21 AM
Some here are taking the term "House of Israel" too literally. Though it may have been used to relate to the northern tribes early on, and in specific contexts (Israel vs. Judah), it became a general term for the people we call "Jews" today. We call ourselves Israel to this day, even in our prayers. This is the way Jesus would have understood it.

Take a look at Psalms 115 and 118, to see how Israel was used as a general term even in the Bible.

iamaberean
July 18th, 2017, 07:47 AM
Some here are taking the term "House of Israel" too literally. Though it may have been used to relate to the northern tribes early on, and in specific contexts (Israel vs. Judah), it became a general term for the people we call "Jews" today. We call ourselves Israel to this day, even in our prayers. This is the way Jesus would have understood it.

Take a look at Psalms 115 and 118, to see how Israel was used as a general term even in the Bible.

I'll repeat myself.

All Jews are of Israel but not all of Israel are Jews.

God's Truth
July 18th, 2017, 08:35 AM
The lost sheep of Israel are the Jews Jesus spoke to.
No they are not!

They were called sheep because they were already God's.
Yes, you are right here.

They were lost because they did not have an appropriate shepherd to lead them.
This is because they had gone a whoring after other gods.

Matthew 15:24 He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of Israel."
You have misquoted scripture,
Mat 15:24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
The house of Israel was referring to those that had lived in northern Israel before their capture.

Jesus spent his time here on earth instructing those who lived in the area, Jews.


I gave scriptures so you cannot say 'no'.

Jesus came first for the lost sheep of Israel.

It used to be that all Jews were saved as long as they did the purification/ceremonial works.

However, God did not like that.

So God was going to give a new covenant.

This new covenant was going to be based on 'faith', unlike the old law that was not based on faith it was based on some works a person could do to be called a child of God. Those works are the ceremonial/purification works.

God cut off all the Jews who did not already have faith in Him. God cut them off and bound them all over to the same exact place as the Gentiles who were unsaved.

Paul calls it Jews first then Gentiles. That means Jesus came only for the lost sheep of Israel, but then ALL can come to him to be saved AFTER they received the message first. WHY? WHY you might ask. BECAUSE the Jews who had faith were the Jews who already belonged to God by obedience to the purification works and by faith.

You are speaking about worthless things when you speak about certain Jews ACCORDING TO REGIONS AND BLOOD RELATIONS.

God cut off ALL JEWS who did NOT HAVE FAITH.

God gave to Jesus only the Jews who had FAITH.

Being a Jew from a certain region or being a Jew from a certain son or brother does NOT MATTER. Only Jews with FAITH mattered and to this day it is the only people who matter to God.

chair
July 18th, 2017, 08:36 AM
I'll repeat myself.

All Jews are of Israel but not all of Israel are Jews.

I do not know what that means.

I do know that your statement "The house of Israel was referring to those that had lived in northern Israel before their capture" in incorrect. That is what I was pointing out. It is wrong.

jamie
July 18th, 2017, 08:41 AM
"And when the children of your people speak to you, saying, ‘Will you not show us what you mean by these?’— say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord God: Surely I will take the stick of Joseph, which is in the hand of Ephraim and the tribes of Israel his companions and I will join them with it with the stick of Judah and make them one stick and they will be one in My hand." (Ezekiel 37:18-19)

jamie
July 18th, 2017, 08:53 AM
Some here are taking the term "House of Israel" too literally.


I wonder if Jeremiah used it too literally.

"Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah" (Jeremiah 31:31)

Nope, I think he meant it.

The Jews have written off the King of Israel and they seem to believe God has forsaken the birthright nations.

chair
July 18th, 2017, 09:04 AM
I wonder if Jeremiah used it too literally.

"Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah" (Jeremiah 31:31)

Nope, I think he meant it.

The Jews have written off the King of Israel and they seem to believe God has forsaken the birthright nations.

Please read my post again. Here it is, for your convenience:

Some here are taking the term "House of Israel" too literally. Though it may have been used to relate to the northern tribes early on, and in specific contexts (Israel vs. Judah), it became a general term for the people we call "Jews" today. We call ourselves Israel to this day, even in our prayers. This is the way Jesus would have understood it.

Take a look at Psalms 115 and 118, to see how Israel was used as a general term even in the Bible.

I've put the relevant part in bold letters. But please read the whole thing.

Jesus was an unfortunate Jew.Not a king. Not a man-god.
So it goes.