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nzira.patie
April 20th, 2016, 11:47 PM
Just have been considering this. Are we all children of God. How justified is this. Can science approve it? What does the bible say

nzira.patie
April 21st, 2016, 12:08 AM
Are all human beings divine

theophilus
April 21st, 2016, 05:30 AM
No.

We are made "in the image" of God but sin has destroyed all the traces within us. We are cursed, fallen, born to trouble as sparks fly upward, our hearts are deceitful and desperately wicked, full of murderous and adulterous thoughts continually and we are sinners and rebels.

Some of us who have accepted the substitutionary death of Christ as our own are clothed with His righteousness and obedience and will someday appear just as He is.

In this life and flesh we are imperfect reflections of our most Holy Father but we will be changed, in the twinkling of an eye.

Guaranteed.

:)

(this is the short version.)

theophilus
April 21st, 2016, 05:33 AM
Read your Bible. Understand that it is NOT a science text-book.

Believe that Jesus Christ is Who He said He is. Accept, by faith, that He died in your place and you can have life, and more abundantly, in Him, by obedience.

God proved His Sonship and Authority by raising Him from the dead. He is the Lord of Glory.

:)

Totton Linnet
April 21st, 2016, 06:27 AM
As many as receive [Christ] to THEM gives He power to become the children of God

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 08:10 AM
Just have been considering this. Are we all children of God. How justified is this. Can science approve it? What does the bible say

As many as receive [Christ] to THEM gives He power to become the children of God
:thumb: Good catch.

There are a lot of people that like to claim, "We are all God's children," but that is in direct contrast to the Bible which states we are given the "power to become the children of God."

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 08:13 AM
:thumb: Good catch.

There are a lot of people that like to claim, "We are all God's children," but that is in direct contrast to the Bible which states we are given the "power to become the children of God."

so all we have to do is say the Our Father?

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 08:15 AM
Are all human beings divine
No, all human beings are not God(s).
There are some religions that like to claim that there is a spark of the divine in each person, but that really is just the life given to us by God.
Life is not divinity (godhood), since plants, insects, and animals all have that same life in them.

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 08:18 AM
Are all human beings divine

all are part of God
-nothing can exist outside of God

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 08:21 AM
so all we have to do is say the Our Father?

There is no mention in the Lord's Prayer about receiving Christ.

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 08:24 AM
There is no mention in the Lord's Prayer about receiving Christ.

so why would we say the Our Father
-if
-we weren't children of God

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 08:33 AM
so why would we say the Our Father
-if
-we weren't children of God
If we already are the children of God, why would we need to wait for the adoption?

Romans 8:23
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

Sherman
April 21st, 2016, 08:42 AM
Moving this to Religion.

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 08:43 AM
If we already are the children of God, why would we need to wait for the adoption?

Romans 8:23
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

what paul says is not always clear
-but
-it is very clear what Jesus said about the Our Father

PureX
April 21st, 2016, 08:59 AM
Just have been considering this. Are we all children of God. How justified is this. Can science approve it? What does the bible sayMost people who believe in "God" believe that God is the source, sustenance and purpose of all that exists. Including ourselves. And in that sense, we are all "God's children".

As evidence for this belief, most people would site our capacity for love and compassion and forgiveness and generosity as examples of the divine spirit within us, as we reflect the spirit of the God which created and sustains us. But this is not 'science', it's theology. Science doesn't address questions about "God" because science can only address questions about the mechanics of the physical universe.

The Bible does address this question, often, even; but unfortunately, it only does so using vague and poetic/symbolic language. And anyway, the Bible was written be men, not God, and so can only contain man's ideas about humanity's relationship to God. And even then, only the ideas of a specific group of men. So that whatever answer we derive from it, will still be human opinion.

In the end, like all things God related, we have to decide for ourselves what we will believe about it, based on our hope and faith rather then on anyone else's special knowledge. Because no one else has any special knowledge.

jamie
April 21st, 2016, 09:53 AM
Are all human beings divine



Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust. (2 Peter 1:2-4)

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 10:08 AM
what paul says is not always clear
-but
-it is very clear what Jesus said about the Our Father
Yes, He said not to pray like the Roman Catholics pray the Our Father and Hail Mary.

Matthew 6:7
7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 10:12 AM
Yes, He said not to pray like the Roman Catholics pray the Our Father and Hail Mary.

Matthew 6:7
7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking.
Jesus taught us to pray the Our Father

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 10:20 AM
Jesus taught us to pray the Our Father

Jesus taught us not to pray with vain repetitions, but the Roman Catholics, with their rosaries, have turned the Lord's Prayer into vain repetitions and joined it with idolatry with the Hail Mary and the rosary.

Praying to God is supposed to be a blessing, not a penance.

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 10:23 AM
Jesus taught us not to pray with vain repetitions, but the Roman Catholics, with their rosaries, have turned the Lord's Prayer into vain repetitions and joined it with idolatry with the Hail Mary and the rosary.

Praying to God is supposed to be a blessing, not a penance.

do you say the Our Father?

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 10:28 AM
do you say the Our Father?
I occasionally pray the prayer the Lord Jesus the Messiah gave to us to help us keep our priorities straight.
You know the one that says "Thy will be done."

Has a priest told you to repeat the Our Father a number of times as a penance?
Where in the Bible does it say that the Lord's Prayer should be vainly repeated over and over as a penance?

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 10:34 AM
I occasionally pray the prayer the Lord Jesus the Messiah gave to us to help us keep our priorities straight.
You know the one that says "Thy will be done."

Has a priest told you to repeat the Our Father a number of times as a penance?
Where in the Bible does it say that the Lord's Prayer should be vainly repeated over and over as a penance?

how many times can you say it each day?
-how do you know you are a child of God?

genuineoriginal
April 21st, 2016, 10:47 AM
how many times can you say it each day?
How many times does it take for it to become vain repetition?
Do it one time less than that.


-how do you know you are a child of God?
That sounds like the Protestants asking if you have been born again and if you have been saved.

Right now I have the Spirit of adoption (Romans 8:15), which is also the same holy Spirit of promise (Ephesians 1:13) that says I will receive Salvation when the Lord Jesus returns.

Why do you assume that the adoption has happened in the past when the Bible states we are waiting for the adoption (Romans 8:23)?

chrysostom
April 21st, 2016, 10:49 AM
How many times does it take for it to become vain repetition?

you tell us
-you are the one with the problem

Nihilo
April 21st, 2016, 11:27 AM
I occasionally pray the prayer the Lord Jesus the Messiah gave to us to help us keep our priorities straight.
You know the one that says "Thy will be done."Yes, "On earth as it is in heaven."

Has a priest told you to repeat the Our Father a number of times as a penance?
Where in the Bible does it say that the Lord's Prayer should be vainly repeated over and over as a penance?Where does the Church teach to pray vainly, ever?

SonOfCaleb
April 21st, 2016, 01:20 PM
Just have been considering this. Are we all children of God. How justified is this. Can science approve it? What does the bible say

No. Humans are mortal. Only the spirit sons of God are described as such in the Bible. These sons of God are divine each one being made directly by God.

Genesis 6:4 "..During that time the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men, and these bore sons to them. They were the mighty ones of old times, the men of fame."

jamie
April 21st, 2016, 02:27 PM
Genesis 6:4 "..During that time the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men, and these bore sons to them. They were the mighty ones of old times, the men of fame."


The sons of God being referred to are men. (Luke 3:38) Adam was a son of God and the last Adam is the Son of God.

SonOfCaleb
April 22nd, 2016, 02:26 AM
The sons of God being referred to are men. (Luke 3:38) Adam was a son of God and the last Adam is the Son of God.

No they're not. And there's nothing scripturally that supports this position. In fact the verse i qouted certainly doesnt support the "Sons of God" being ordinary men or humans.

Genesis 6:4 "..During that time the sons of the true God continued to have relations with the daughters of men, and these bore sons to them.They were the mighty ones of old times, the men of fame."

This verse refers to the Nephilim who were the hybrid offspring of angels who materialized into humans and had relations with the Adams offspring. Genesis 6:2 sets the context for this where it says "the sons of the true God began to notice that the daughters of men were beautiful. So they began taking as wives all whom they chose." The opening part of verse 4 continues " The Nephʹi·lim were on the earth in those days and afterward".

These are definitive statements with a definitive context highlighting a marked difference between the offspring of Adam of which his lineage is listed in the previous chapter 5, but then Moses writes about this completely different offspring who were the "the mighty ones of old times. The Men of Fame" only a few verses later. If these Nephilim were the direct offspring of Adam there would have been no need to even mention these hybrid Giants (Nephilim) seperately when in the preceding chapter Moses wrote down Adams lineage. In addition its evident from the verse that these hybrid offspring were very unique. They were called mighty ones, and men of fame. These men were so famous that to this day giants feature heavily in almost all culutural myths and legends around the globe.
Why would Moses mention their marriage to the daughters of men as something special? Marriage and childbearing had been taking place for more than 1,500 years. Likewise how was Adams offspring capable of producing these giants or Nephilim if indeed the Sons of God were men. Thus the erroenous position of thinking the Sons of God were men is not only unsupported in the Bible it raises more questions than answers, as the Bible shows these Sons of God were Angels who fathered their Nephilim offspring.

Note Job 38:4-7 Jehovah God himself spoke directly to Job telling him:-

4 Where were you when I founded the earth?
Tell me, if you think you understand.
*5 Who set its measurements, in case you know,
Or who stretched a measuring line across it?
*6 Into what were its pedestals sunk,
Or who laid its cornerstone,
*7 When the morning stars joyfully cried out together,
And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?

This describes events long before the creation of Adam. And yet Jehovah in his OWN words calls his angelic creation the "Sons of God".

Again Moses writes in Job 1:6 "Now the day came when the sons of the true God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and Satan also entered among them."
This verse describes the predeceding events in Heaven before Job faced his trial at Satans hand. Again Moses uses the Hebrew idiom for Angels "Sons of God" to describe the Angels -including Satan- who took their station before Jehovah.

genuineoriginal
April 22nd, 2016, 12:44 PM
Yes, "On earth as it is in heaven."
Where does the Church teach to pray vainly, ever?

In the confessional.

john w
April 22nd, 2016, 02:07 PM
Genesis 3:5 KJV for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

Nihilo
April 22nd, 2016, 04:58 PM
"Thy will be done."



"On earth as it is in heaven."
. . .
Where does the Church teach to pray vainly, ever?

In the confessional.It is in the repetition that you come to understand experientially what it is to be honest. Because when you recognize vain repetition, you're not being honest, so you become honest in order to not vainly repeat. In this way you learn honesty, and you trespass less.
. . .
"Give us this day our daily bread"

Nihilo
April 22nd, 2016, 05:08 PM
Genesis 3:5 KJV for God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.This is not on earth as it is in heaven: the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons. Heaven is apron-free. And it has nothing to do with wearing clothes, but with hiding trespasses. We all do it, and the Church's sacrament of penance or reconciliation or reconversion (confession) is the way in which Our Father distributes His favor to the Church regarding this apron issue.

My take anyway. :e4e:

Bright Raven
April 23rd, 2016, 05:22 PM
There is only one human who is divine, Jesus Christ.