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Angel4Truth
April 9th, 2016, 05:27 PM
A friend sent me this article, im wondering how you all here on tol would respond to the atheists concern and what you think about the response given by "abby" - thanks!


DEAR ABBY: About a year ago, my daughter befriended a schoolmate. After numerous play-dates, our families have become close. While my family is atheist, we know this family is devoutly Christian.

Recently, after I mentioned in conversation that we “weren’t religious,” they invited us to their church for service. I diplomatically declined, but it felt awkward having told the mom our non-beliefs.

Since then, this family invites us to church constantly, and the mom routinely brings up Scripture while we’re talking. I feel like they are trying to convert us. I’m hurt that the respect we have extended to this family isn’t being reciprocated.

How do I let her know she’s being disrespectful to me and my family’s beliefs without jeopardizing the friendship between our families? — ATHEIST IN THE SOUTH

DEAR ATHEIST: I can’t guarantee that the woman won’t take offense, but it’s less likely if you refrain from using the word “disrespectful.” Try to remember that she thinks she’s offering you the keys to the kingdom of heaven.

It might be gentler if you told her that in light of the fact that you are an atheist, you find what she’s trying to do to be “hurtful.” Continue to politely refuse her invitations to attend her church.

If she’s in the habit of quoting Scripture in normal conversation, you will have to grit your teeth and tolerate it. (Remember, we all have freedom of expression.)

But I can’t guarantee that you will always remain as close as you have been, not because she’s hurt that you’re not interested in being converted, but because at some point you may find her behavior so annoying that YOU will end the relationship. - Abby

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 05:30 PM
A friend sent me this article, im wondering how you all here on tol would respond to the atheists concern and what you think about the response given by "abby" - thanks!

Lk 12:51

patrick jane
April 9th, 2016, 05:51 PM
Yeah, let's not upset the atheists by preaching Jesus

Hedshaker
April 9th, 2016, 06:38 PM
Yeah, let's not upset the atheists by preaching Jesus

How would you feel if a Muslim associate constantly spouted Islamic blurb at you?

Yeah, let's not upset the Christians by preaching Muhammad

csuguy
April 9th, 2016, 06:38 PM
There's nothing wrong or disrespectful with the Christian family sharing their faith with an atheistic one or inviting them to church. However, simply repeatedly asking them to attend their church when they continually turn you down is not a very good method of going about it. After a point, as we see here, it starts to strain the relationship - so the family should take a hint.

That doesn't mean the Christians should cease sharing their faith, but it means that if they really want to reach them that they need to change their approach. They should remain good friends with these people and help them as they are able - demonstrating through their actions their faith. Talk is cheap; but by being an active, positive force in their lives and the lives of others, they can inspire in this other family an interest in their faith.

exminister
April 9th, 2016, 06:52 PM
There's nothing wrong or disrespectful with the Christian family sharing their faith with an atheistic one or inviting them to church. However, simply repeatedly asking them to attend their church when they continually turn you down is not a very good method of going about it. After a point, as we see here, it starts to strain the relationship - so the family should take a hint.

That doesn't mean the Christians should cease sharing their faith, but it means that if they really want to reach them that they need to change their approach. They should remain good friends with these people and help them as they are able - demonstrating through their actions their faith. Talk is cheap; but by being an active, positive force in their lives and the lives of others, they can inspire in this other family an interest in their faith.

Actions speak louder than words. Repetitive words are for controlling and manipulating others. Less is definitely more in such situations.

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 07:22 PM
Yeah, let's not upset the atheists by preaching Jesus


...[L]et's not upset the Christians by preaching Muhammad

:dizzy: Ac 4:12

Lon
April 9th, 2016, 07:53 PM
How would you feel if a Muslim associate constantly spouted Islamic blurb at you?

Yeah, let's not upset the Christians by preaching Muhammad
Well, first of all, you have to actually have a Muslim friend. Second of all, if you don't convert, he'll proceed with another course of action.

:Plain: You guys don't get this 'comparison' thing very well most of the time. You always seem to do it wrong. You should have simply asked how we'd like it if an atheist kept preaching at us, you know, like you guys can't help but do all the time on TOL?

6days
April 9th, 2016, 08:24 PM
How would you feel if a Muslim associate constantly spouted Islamic blurb at you?I would absolutely love it!! It is great when people of other faiths (including atheist) are willing to discuss things that are important to them. It gives us a chance to share who we are too. (And, I really do enjoy discussing "Islamic blurb" with Muslims.)

Hedshaker
April 9th, 2016, 08:50 PM
I would absolutely love it!! It is great when people of other faiths (including atheist) are willing to discuss things that are important to them. It gives us a chance to share who we are too. (And, I really do enjoy discussing "Islamic blurb" with Muslims.)

I don't mind discussion either, but preaching...... not so much. Though, for me the subject of religion rarely comes up outside of this board. The subject tends to cause eyes to roll in my neck of the woods.

patrick jane
April 9th, 2016, 09:27 PM
How would you feel if a Muslim associate constantly spouted Islamic blurb at you?

Yeah, let's not upset the Christians by preaching Muhammad
I would kill him for being an infidel

Hedshaker
April 9th, 2016, 10:01 PM
I would kill him for being an infidel

Some punishment! Then he gets his 72 virgins...... :shocked:

iamaberean
April 10th, 2016, 05:11 AM
A friend sent me this article, im wondering how you all here on tol would respond to the atheists concern and what you think about the response given by "abby" - thanks!

Which is worse, a person who admits to being an non-believer and not wanting to discuss the bible, or a person who admits to being a believer but not wanting to discuss the bible?

I know both types and and it is very hard to do what the scripture says.

Mat 10:12 And when ye come into an house, salute it.
Mat 10:13 And if the house be worthy, let your peace come upon it: but if it be not worthy, let your peace return to you.
Mat 10:14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 08:24 AM
From what is expressed in the letter, I am not seeing that the woman was being overly offensive ... however, not being part of the situation, it's hard to say. Having a friend, neighbor or even relative invite me to church wouldn't be a problem. I have even, not so long ago, accepted the invitation. The person didn't hound me to keep going which was appreciated. She knew if I wished to go back, I would simply show up or ask if I could accompany her.

Discussing religion and listening to a person's religious beliefs has never been a problem either when done so respectfully. There is a huge difference in discussing VS preaching and convicting.

PureX
April 10th, 2016, 08:51 AM
In AA there is a saying: "attraction, not promotion".

The idea is that when we try to promote sobriety to people who like being drunk, we will get nowhere. OF COURSE! How could it be otherwise? But if we refrain from promoting sobriety to those folks, and continue to live positive sober lives, ourselves, they may well begin to notice the value in doing so, through us. And so come to question their own assumptions about being drunk. (I'm referring to alcoholics, here, not most average folks.)

And the long, hard-won experience of AA has shown that this method does work, far better, than 'proselytizing' sobriety to active alcoholics.

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 08:56 AM
IAnd the long, hard-won experience of AA has shown that this method does work, far better, than 'proselytizing' sobriety to active alcoholics.

Of course it does ... someone who walks the walk doesn't need to proselytize ... their example speaks volumes.

ClimateSanity
April 10th, 2016, 09:28 AM
Of course it does ... someone who walks the walk doesn't need to proselytize ... their example does the speaks volumes.

Regarding showing by example......

People who value character and ethics and morality, will be persuaded by seeing it walked through.

Many Christians, including myself, value Christianity because it offers a way to be acceptable to God that doesn't involve meeting a standard of behavior that isnt always possible.

For some reason, believing God was real was never an issue. Even seeing all the hypocritical behavior of Christians never made me doubt.

Do you think seeing real "Christian" behavior would make God seem more real to you?

If there is any behavior I see that makes me secure in my belief in God, it is the perfect peace of mind I see in real Christians concerning the afterlife.

PureX
April 10th, 2016, 09:50 AM
I think there is a difference between how a Christian would respond to someone who is questioning, and/or seeking a concept/relationship with God, and an atheist. It seems to me to be completely reasonable that a Christian would offer to share their religious beliefs and experiences with an acquaintance who they know to be curious, questioning, or seeking such ideas. In fact, I would say it would be gracious of them.

But not so for an acquaintance who has already stated that he/she is an atheist. Because in that instance they have already made their determination, and are not seeking the Christian's religious ideals, advice, or experiences. So that to offer them in that instance, I think IS both disrespectful, and arrogant.

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 09:56 AM
Do you think seeing real "Christian" behavior would make God seem more real to you?.

I think it's encourages those who have an interest into being more open and/or looking further.

patrick jane
April 10th, 2016, 10:19 AM
I think it's encourages those who have an interest into being more open and/or looking further.
What are your beliefs Rusha ?

patrick jane
April 10th, 2016, 10:24 AM
Of course it does ... someone who walks the walk doesn't need to proselytize ... their example does the speaks volumes.
Are you ok ?

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 10:26 AM
Are you ok ?

:think: I need more caffeine ... but otherwise, hunky-dory. Thanks for asking.

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 10:32 AM
What are your beliefs Rusha ?

I think the main question in regards to establishing beliefs ... goes back to the very beginning of life insofar as creation VS evolution.

patrick jane
April 10th, 2016, 10:44 AM
I think the main question in regards to establishing beliefs ... goes back to the very beginning of life insofar as creation VS evolution.
:salute:

ClimateSanity
April 10th, 2016, 11:11 AM
I think the main question in regards to establishing beliefs ... goes back to the very beginning of life insofar as creation VS evolution.

Evolution is true beyond a shadow of a doubt. Does that eliminate the possibility of God in your mind?

Rusha
April 10th, 2016, 11:13 AM
Evolution is true beyond a shadow of a doubt. Does that eliminate the possibility of God in your mind?

No.

whitestone
April 10th, 2016, 11:16 AM
A friend sent me this article, im wondering how you all here on tol would respond to the atheists concern and what you think about the response given by "abby" - thanks!


Not sure if she even noticed she did(maybe so) but the woman writing to Abby also "preached a sermon",the sermon she preached was public(to Abby,internet,papers,and also on the wwww) in her sermon she stated her beliefs,an expected way she chooses to be treated,seen ect.,,,

Not that I say this to offend any (I am Christian) but as well as she sees the christian as trying to influence/teach/preach what she believes she also(the atheist)is both trying to convey her beliefs upon the christian woman/daughter.

The children possibly have a better chance at it in that they will probably just play together and not be offended with one another. As time goes on ,,example jr high/high school things may change as the both mature. One may begin to ponder Jesus and the other my begin to doubt Christianity depending on things they hear from one another about their beliefs.

The point I'm trying to make though is that if a Christian were to write to Abby,post on the www,go to someones house ect. and preach then it would be viewed as "preaching",,,on the other hand when an atheist writes to Abby,post on the www,tries to convey their beliefs to others it is suppose to be received as "not preaching",,,in all reality they are both the same, the thing is though one is hidden.

Jose Fly
April 10th, 2016, 12:39 PM
I actually find myself in this sort of situation a lot, and I rarely have problems. All I do is say something like...

I realize you're a Christian and you're eager to share that with me, but please understand that I grew up in a Christian environment, so I do know what the faith is about. It's just not something I've ever believed and I would say it's highly unlikely I'll ever believe it. So there's really no need for you to keep asking me to go to church or keep trying to convert me. But I like hanging out with you, so hopefully we can move on and still be friends.

whitestone
April 10th, 2016, 03:58 PM
I actually find myself in this sort of situation a lot, and I rarely have problems. All I do is say something like...

I realize you're a Christian and you're eager to share that with me, but please understand that I grew up in a Christian environment, so I do know what the faith is about. It's just not something I've ever believed and I would say it's highly unlikely I'll ever believe it. So there's really no need for you to keep asking me to go to church or keep trying to convert me. But I like hanging out with you, so hopefully we can move on and still be friends.


lol,Me too,same paragraph except the nouns are reversed. The two of them will either see both things or neither,,,

6days
April 10th, 2016, 04:15 PM
I think the main question in regards to establishing beliefs ... goes back to the very beginning of life insofar as creation VS evolution.
Many come to faith while still firmly committed to 'you from goo' beliefs. Not always, but often, evolutionary beliefs disappear as their eyes are opened to truth. World renowned geneticist, Dr. John Sanford said "I was totally sold on evolution. It was my religion; it defined how I saw everything, it was my value system and my reason for being. Later, I came to believe in “God”, but this still did not significantly change my intellectual outlook regarding origins. However, still later, as I began to personally know and submit to Jesus, I started to be fundamentally changed—in every respect. This included my mind, and how I viewed science and history. I would not say that science led me to the Lord (which is the experience of some). Rather I would say Jesus opened my eyes to His creation—I was blind, and gradually I could see. It sounds simple, but it was a slow and painful process"

whitestone
April 10th, 2016, 04:31 PM
That is the true issue. Either there was an man(not yet evolved)and so needed no Savior because of not being completely evolved,therefore innocent.

Then along comes an man further evolved and in need of some measure of innocence,yet also some measure of reconciliation.

Then though eventually will come the perfectly evolved man in need of no Savior,the man who either has evolved enough to not commit iniquity or an man committed to it.

This in it's process cancels out the necessity of an Savior until the final evolutionary standard of an man is come,,,but to whose standard?

Evolution then therefore holds the standard as to who has become "no longer innocent" and the standard is therefore then the last man.