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serpentdove
April 3rd, 2016, 11:59 AM
[Catholics Must Submit their Mind, Will, and Intellect to Papal Authority Proclaiming the Gospel Ministries] :olinger: "Roman Catholics are morally bound to believe whatever the pope teaches, even when he does not speak "ex Cathedra," from the chair of Peter. This means that Catholics are forbidden to believe what the Word of God teaches :Poly: unless the pope teaches the same doctrine. Following are two compelling laws that have been established to control what Catholics think and believe:

"Each individual must receive the faith and law from the Church with unquestioning submission and obedience of the intellect and the will. ... We have no right to ask reasons of the Church, any more than of Almighty God. ... We are to take with unquestioning docility whatever instruction the Church gives us" (The Catholic World, August 1871, vol. xiii, pp. 58089 (https://books.google.com/books?id=4BnmQWtxeAIC&pg=PA42&lpg=PA42&dq=The+Catholic+World,+August+1871++vol.+xiii,+pp. +58089&source=bl&ots=t2RCVkBjLh&sig=xGLGA_w0ErpbJt-ovy7D3Hzh1MU&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj4uLqustTLAhVJjz4KHVDpDYUQ6AEIITAB#v=on epage&q=The%20Catholic%20World%2C%20August%201871%20%20v ol.%20xiii%2C%20pp.%2058089&f=false)).

"The faithful, for their part, are obliged to submit to their bishops' decision, made in the name of Christ, in matters of faith and morals, and to adhere to it with a ready and respectful allegiance of mind. This loyal submission of the will and intellect must be given, in a special way, to the authentic teaching authority of the Roman Pontiff, even when he does not speak ex cathedra in such wise, indeed, that his supreme teaching authority be acknowledged with respect, and the one sincerely adhere to decision made by him, conformably with his manifest mind and intention." Lumen Gentium (https://books.google.com/books?id=I9UQOKxXOcQC&pg=PA381&lpg=PA381&dq=Lumen+Gentium+teaches:Bishops+who+teach+in+comm union+with+the+Roman+Pontiff+are+to+be+revered+by+ all+as+witnesses+of+divine+and+Catholic+truth;+the +faithful,+for+their+part,+are+obliged+to+submit+t o+their+bishops'+decision&source=bl&ots=BPjmlEVHft&sig=eiztDh4Buj4vQaIoGZWMiZ4EI7g&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjX47DDt9TLAhVIbD4KHWMPB4QQ6AEIJzAC#v=on epage&q=Lumen%20Gentium%20teaches%3ABishops%20who%20teac h%20in%20communion%20with%20the%20Roman%20Pontiff% 20are%20to%20be%20revered%20by%20all%20as%20witnes ses%20of%20divine%20and%20Catholic%20truth%3B%20th e%20faithful%2C%20for%20their%20part%2C%20are%20ob liged%20to%20submit%20to%20their%20bishops'%20deci sion&f=false)

[Mike Gendron Comment] We must encourage Catholics to submit to the supreme authority of God's Word and to destroy every argument raised against the knowledge of God. The Bible instructs all of us to take every thought captive to the obedience of our Lord Jesus Christ (2 Cor. 10:5)." Pro-Gospel.org

Robert Pate
April 5th, 2016, 04:43 PM
Good post.

Sit down, shut up and go to hell is what the Catholic church says.

If you raise any questions that are contrary to what they teach you could be anathema (kicked out of the Catholic church) To be expelled from the Catholic church is to be sentenced to hell.

serpentdove
April 6th, 2016, 11:23 AM
Sit down, shut up and go to hell is what the Catholic church says.

:olinger: Jer 5:31

Predi
April 7th, 2016, 03:13 PM
Good post.

Sit down, shut up and go to hell is what the Catholic church says.

If you raise any questions that are contrary to what they teach you could be anathema (kicked out of the Catholic church) To be expelled from the Catholic church is to be sentenced to hell.

And what's really hilarious, the very most of Catholics do have doubts and they don't even know they're anathema! In Poland, where I come from, over 90% people declares they're Catholic while 60% people say they don't believe the devil/satan exists!

Cruciform
April 7th, 2016, 04:37 PM
Catholics Must Submit their Mind, Will, and Intellect to Papal Authority
All this means is that Catholics interpret the Bible according to the formal teachings of Christ's one historic Church (http://scripturecatholic.com/the_church.html), just as non-Catholics are bound to interpret the Bible according to the opinions of their chosen recently-invented, man-made non-Catholic sect. Each is taught to view Scripture through the lens of his particular doctrinal tradition---and that applies to Protestants every bit as much as to Catholics.

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 09:05 AM
All this means is that Catholics interpret the Bible according to the formal teachings of Christ's one historic Church... :dizzy: Eph 4:14

See:

Mithraism and the Catholic Church (http://www.hope-of-israel.org/mithraism.html)

What is the origin of the Catholic Church? (http://www.gotquestions.org/origin-Catholic-church.html)

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2016, 09:06 AM
[FONT=Georgia]All this means is that Catholics interpret the Bible according to the formal teachings of Christ's one historic Church (http://scripturecatholic.com/the_church.html),

:chuckle:

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 11:25 AM
All this means is that Catholics interpret the Bible according to the formal teachings of Christ's one historic Church...


:chuckle:
http://smayli.ru/data/smiles/zodiaki-92.gif

See:

The Pope's Mitre (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/vatican/esp_vatican138.htm)

chrysostom
April 8th, 2016, 11:31 AM
you can't trust what serpentdove posts
-you can trust what the pope says

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2016, 11:32 AM
-you can trust what the pope says

:chuckle:

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 11:35 AM
you can't trust what serpentdove posts
-you can trust what the pope says

:yawn: I have no doubt that you are a good :o CathOlic :olinger: (Jud 11 :burnlib:).

Pope urges acceptance of gays, divorced (http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/08/europe/vatican-pope-family/index.html)

chrysostom
April 8th, 2016, 11:37 AM
:yawn: I have no doubt that you are a good :o CathOlic :olinger: (Jud 11 :burnlib:).

Pope urges acceptance of gays, divorced (http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/08/europe/vatican-pope-family/index.html)

the pope urges acceptance of people like you, a sinner, because we are all sinners

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 11:40 AM
...In Poland, where I come from, over 90% people declares they're Catholic while 60% people say they don't believe the devil/satan exists!

He exists (1 Jn 2:18).

http://www.neolaia.gr/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/Photo-of-the-Day-Time-Magazine-Gives-Pope-Francis-Devil-Horns-on-Person-of-the-Year-2013-Cover.jpg

ok doser
April 8th, 2016, 11:40 AM
the pope urges acceptance of people like you, a sinner, because we are all sinners

the pope urges acceptance of people who want to be allowed to continue in their sins?

the pope urges acceptance of people who force society to accept their sinfulness as "normal"?


seems like a pretty silly thing to do :idunno:

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 11:47 AM
the pope urges acceptance of people like you...

You're a CathOlic :freak: so let me educate you regarding your own religion (2 Ti 3:7). :olinger:

"One of the things that the Roman Catholic Church does in its councils and in its official writings is to pronounce anathema upon those who would disagree with some of its declarations..." Full text: Anathema (https://carm.org/anathema)

Cruciform
April 8th, 2016, 03:11 PM
Eph 4:14
Applies perfectly to the myriad recently-invented, man-made sects of Protestantism.

Post #5 stands exactly as stated.

whatever67
April 8th, 2016, 03:47 PM
:olinger: Jer 5:31

ever see a shrink about why you hate catholicism so much?

and probably catholics as well?

chrysostom
April 8th, 2016, 03:55 PM
"One of the things that the Roman Catholic Church does in its councils and in its official writings is to pronounce anathema upon those who would disagree with some of its declarations..."

the church has to deal with many heresies
-that is her job
-they are serious and must be dealt with in a serious manner

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 04:25 PM
Post #5 stands...

:yawn: Non causae ut causae Eph 4:14

serpentdove
April 8th, 2016, 04:27 PM
[E]ver see a shrink about why you hate catholicism so much?

Ro 12:9

Cruciform
April 8th, 2016, 04:49 PM
:yawn: Non causae ut causae Eph 4:14
Already answered in statements that have yet to be refuted.

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 11:15 AM
the church has to deal with many heresies
-that is her job...
1 Pe 4:17, Jud 11 :burnlib:

See:

Love Your Enemies (http://www.ligonier.org/learn/sermons/love-your-enemies/) R.C. Sproul

whatever67
April 9th, 2016, 03:15 PM
Ro 12:9

if you catholic haters clung to what is good, you wouldn't hate catholics

sure, u will claim you dont hate them. Right. I see a lot of hostility directed @ Catholics

if you were of good will, you also would not put down a Church that stands against so much evil (abortion, divorce/re-marriage, etc)

but i guess a lot of people just HAVE TO make themselves feel better than--someone

whatever67
April 9th, 2016, 03:17 PM
1 Pe 4:17, Jud 11 :burnlib:

See:

Love Your Enemies (http://www.ligonier.org/learn/sermons/love-your-enemies/) R.C. Sproul

I guess this Sproul guy is your pope?

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 03:42 PM
If you Catholic haters... :yawn: If we hated Catholics, :olinger: we wouldn't bother telling them the truth (Ac 20:20). :Poly:


...clung to what is good, you wouldn't hate Catholics. We hate false teaching :listen: as we are told to hate (Ps 119:128).


...[S]ure, u will claim you don't hate them. Right. I see a lot of hostility directed @ Catholics..." "If evil doesn't bother you--you're evil." ~ Darrell Ferguson


If you were of good will, you also would not put down a Church that stands against so much evil (abortion, divorce/re-marriage, etc) Forgive me. I didn't realize that you'd been living under a rock.

Pope urges acceptance of gays, divorced (http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/08/europe/vatican-pope-family/index.html) Eph 5:3


But I guess a lot of people just have to make themselves feel better than--someone. :yawn: Does your writing this make you feel better? :freak: Eph 4:14

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 03:47 PM
Already answered...

:yawn: As a reminder, Cruciform is a grace-perverter :olinger: (Gal. 1:68), bound by traditions (Mt 15:9) and deceitful in all his ways (Eph. 4:14).

See:

Cruciform (http://vananne.com/serpentdove/Cruciform.htm)

Cruciform
April 9th, 2016, 05:05 PM
As a reminder, Cruciform is a grace-perverter (Gal. 1:6–8), bound by traditions (Mt 15:9) and deceitful in all his ways (Eph. 4:14).
As a reminder, serpent is a known public liar (Prov. 19:5) and deliberate distorter of Catholic belief and practice (Ex. 20:16), whose vast ignorance (Eph. 4:18) is only matched by his tragically-vacuous intellect (1 Cor. 14:20).

Again, he has already been decisively answered in earlier statements that have yet to be refuted by him in any way whatsoever.

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 05:13 PM
[:yawn: As a reminder, Cruciform is a grace-perverter :olinger: (Gal. 1:6–8), bound by traditions (Mt 15:9) and deceitful in all his ways (Eph. 4:14). See: Cruciform (http://vananne.com/serpentdove/Cruciform.htm)] As a reminder, serpent is a known public liar...

:yawn: Proof please (Eph 4:14). :peach:

Cruciform
April 9th, 2016, 05:17 PM
Proof please (Eph 4:14).
Your Post #26 (Eph. 4:14).

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 05:22 PM
[:yawn: Proof I have lied (Eph 4:14). :peach:] Your Post #26 (Eph 4:14).
:yawn: Let the reader decide (Eph 4:14). :noway:

We are saved by grace alone (Eph 2:8-9), through faith alone (Eph 1:13; 2Ti 1:10), in Christ alone (Isa 45:21,22; 59:16; Ac 4:12). :Poly: Roman Catholics :olinger: deny this (Jude 1:11). :burnlib:

See:

Roman Catholicism (http://vananne.com/culttoasters/#Roman_Catholicism)

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 05:25 PM
[See: Love Your Enemies (http://www.ligonier.org/learn/sermons/love-your-enemies/) R.C. Sproul] I guess this Sproul guy is your pope?

:yawn: 1 Jn 2:27

Cruciform
April 9th, 2016, 05:32 PM
Let the reader decide (Eph 4:14). We are saved by grace alone (Eph 2:8-9), through faith alone (Eph 1:13; 2Ti 1:10), in Christ alone (Isa 45:21,22; 59:16; Ac 4:12). Roman Catholics deny this (Jude 1:11).
Thank you for merely proving here my statements in Post #27.


See:
Roman Catholicism (http://vananne.com/culttoasters/#Roman_Catholicism)
serpent only further supports my posted statements by appealing to a source that categorically promotes lies and misrepresentations of Catholic teaching and practice, just as serpent himself does above.

serpentdove
April 9th, 2016, 05:36 PM
Thank you for merely proving here my statements…[S]erpent only further supports my posted statements…

:yawn: Non causae ut causae Eph 4:14

You have magnified Your word above all Your name (Ps 138:2). :Poly:

Cruciform
April 9th, 2016, 08:56 PM
Non causae ut causae
...which actually disproves nothing whatsoever of my statements. Thus, Post #32 stands exactly as given.


Eph 4:14
Eph. 4:14


You have magnified Your word above all Your name (Ps 138:2).

...but not serpent's preferred interpretations of His word. Big difference there.

Nor does "word" necessarily mean "Scripture," your unbiblical assumption aside.

serpentdove
April 10th, 2016, 11:00 AM
...which actually disproves nothing whatsoever of my statements... :yawn: Non causae ut causae Eph 4:14


[:yawn: As a reminder, Cruciform is a grace-perverter :olinger: (Gal. 1:68), bound by traditions (Mt 15:9) and deceitful in all his ways (Eph. 4:14). See: Cruciform (http://vananne.com/serpentdove/Cruciform.htm)] Eph 4:14 :yawn: Intensional Ga 5:9, Eph 4:14


[You have magnified Your word above all Your name (Ps 138:2).] ...but not serpent's preferred interpretations :yawn: Truth is truth independent from me (Ac 5:29, Mt 15:9).

"Roman Catholicism vs. historical, biblical Christianity: "We have different authorities, we believe different gospels, we worship different Christs, we are led by different spirits and we are on different paths to eternity. Compare this with the unity the apostle Paul described with those who are in one body and one ......Spirit, with one hope; one Lord, one faith, one baptism, on God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all (Eph 4:4-6)..." Full text: No Idolatry and False Teaching (http://vananne.com/culttoasters/No%20Idolitry%20False%20Teaching.htm)

Cruciform
April 10th, 2016, 09:38 PM
"---:blabla:---"
Already decisively answered in statements that serpent has yet to in any way actually refute (Post #34). Therefore those statements stand exactly as posted.

patrick jane
April 10th, 2016, 10:32 PM
Already decisively answered in statements that serpent has yet to in any way actually refute (Post #34). Therefore those statements stand exactly as posted.
See post # 36 - you have been refuted as a pope worshiper

serpentdove
April 11th, 2016, 08:08 AM
Already decisively answered...

:yawn: Ad infinitum Eph 4:14

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men [Acts 5:29].

"The apostles were obeying what their Lord and Master had told them to do. Believers are commanded to obey civil authority—except when it comes in conflict with the commandment of God." McGee, Ac 5:29

This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me [Matt. 15:7–8].

"The Lord called the scribes and Pharisees hypocrites. This is the most frightful word in Scripture. Nothing quite corresponds to it, but it did not have quite the meaning in that day that it does today. To us it is a scorching word, but in Jesus’ day it simply meant to answer back and was used of an actor in a play. It means that an actor would receive a cue and then answer back. Jesus accused the scribes and Pharisees of playing at religion.

The religious leaders were eager to have people go through the ceremony of washing their hands, but they ignored the condition of the heart, which was the important thing to God. In a very pious way they were breaking the Mosaic Law.

My friend, we also are pretty good at rationalizing. Parents say to their children, “You wash your hands before you come to the table,” but they pay no attention to what their children see on television, which is the thing that is damaging the heart. Oh, of course, children should wash their hands, but what is on the inside is far more important." McGee, J. V. (1991). Vol. 35: Thru the Bible commentary: The Gospels (Matthew 14-28) (electronic ed.) (35). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

See:

A Scriptural Response to: Biblical Evidence or Catholics St. Joseph Communication (http://vananne.com/culttoasters/Scriptural%20Response%20St_%20Joseph%20Communicati ons_doc.pdf)

Cruciform
April 11th, 2016, 05:17 PM
See post # 36
I've seen it, since I wrote it.


...you have been refuted as a pope worshiper.
Here you have been revealed as a public liar (Prov. 19:5).

Cruciform
April 11th, 2016, 05:18 PM
Ad infinitum...
Already substantially answered (Post #36).

Ben Masada
April 15th, 2016, 11:12 PM
Catholics Must Submit their Mind, Will and Intellect to Papal Authority. That's true if you read the "Summa Theologica" by Thomas Aquinas, the greatest Catholic Theologian of all times. He also said that salvation is possible but only as a Catholic. The Lord have mercy on the rest of us.

Sonnet
April 16th, 2016, 12:17 AM
you can't trust what serpentdove posts
-you can trust what the pope says

Not sure you can entirely - all have sinned and fallen short.

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 05:40 AM
Roman Catholics are morally bound to believe whatever the pope teaches

Serpentdove, you have not addressed what Cruciform wrote in post #5 of this thread.

What you claim as a unique fault of Catholicism is simply a necessary characteristic of all organizations - religious or otherwise.

There exist certain features (beliefs, values, etc) which define people as members or nonmembers of a group.

I can't call myself a football fan if I am against football as a sport.
"Liking football" is a defining characteristic of the group, "football fans."

I can't call myself a vegetarian if I eat meat.
"Not eating meat" is a defining characteristic of the group, "vegetarians."

I can't call myself a Christian if I do not believe that Jesus rose from the dead.
"Believing in Jesus' resurrection" is a defining characteristic of the group, "Christians."


Calling myself Catholic means I have certain beliefs. Who defines the defining characteristics of Catholicism? The Catholic Church, of course. It would make no sense, otherwise.


But don't pretend you don't have your own defining characteristics. You do.

chrysostom
April 16th, 2016, 05:52 AM
Calling myself Catholic means I have certain beliefs. Who defines the defining characteristics of Catholicism? The Catholic Church, of course. It would make no sense, otherwise.


you are making sense
-did you get a catholic education?

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 05:58 AM
you are making sense
-did you get a catholic education?

You dont know?

she said she is catholic.

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:00 AM
you are making sense
-did you get a catholic education?

Partially...

Jewish pre-school.
Public elementary school.
Public high school.
Catholic college.

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:01 AM
You dont know?

she said she is catholic.

*he

This keeps happening... :think:

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 06:03 AM
*he

This keeps happening... :think:

your choice of avatar is deceiving.

chrysostom
April 16th, 2016, 06:04 AM
Serpentdove, you have not addressed what Cruciform wrote in post #5 of this thread.

What you claim as a unique fault of Catholicism is simply a necessary characteristic of all organizations - religious or otherwise.

There exist certain features (beliefs, values, etc) which define people as members or nonmembers of a group.

I can't call myself a football fan if I am against football as a sport.
"Liking football" is a defining characteristic of the group, "football fans."

I can't call myself a vegetarian if I eat meat.
"Not eating meat" is a defining characteristic of the group, "vegetarians."

I can't call myself a Christian if I do not believe that Jesus rose from the dead.
"Believing in Jesus' resurrection" is a defining characteristic of the group, "Christians."


Calling myself Catholic means I have certain beliefs. Who defines the defining characteristics of Catholicism? The Catholic Church, of course. It would make no sense, otherwise.


But don't pretend you don't have your own defining characteristics. You do.

here is another chance for others to read your post

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:04 AM
your choice of avatar is deceiving.

Those little cheeses are delicious.
I stand by my choice.

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 06:06 AM
Those little cheeses are delicious.
I stand by my choice.

then everyone addresses you as she.

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 06:28 AM
Serpentdove, you have not addressed what Cruciform wrote in post #5 of this thread. Already answered (Eph 4:14). :freak:


...Who defines the defining characteristics of Catholicism? The Catholic Church, of course. Re 18:4 :burnlib:

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:12 PM
Already answered (Eph 4:14). :freak:

Re 18:4 :burnlib:

Serpent Dove, are you a member of any particular Christian denomination?

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 06:20 PM
Serpent Dove, are you a member of any particular Christian denomination?

I identify with Christ not a denomination (Mal 4:5, Mt 17:11). :juggle:

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:25 PM
I identify with Christ not a denomination (Mal 4:5, Mt 17:11). :juggle:

But you do call yourself Christian?

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 06:26 PM
But you do call yourself Christian?

Yes (Ac 11:26). :Plain:

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:29 PM
Yes (Ac 11:26). :Plain:

As a Christian, are you free to believe that Christ did not rise from the dead?

Or... if you believed that, could you no longer call yourself Christian?

Cruciform
April 16th, 2016, 06:31 PM
Catholics Must Submit their Mind, Will and Intellect to Papal Authority. That's true if you read the "Summa Theologica" by Thomas Aquinas, the greatest Catholic Theologian of all times. He also said that salvation is possible but only as a Catholic. The Lord have mercy on the rest of us.
It's sad that you really have no idea what any of that actually means, however.

Grosnick Marowbe
April 16th, 2016, 06:44 PM
you can't trust what serpentdove posts
-you can trust what the pope says

You can't trust either one.

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 06:46 PM
As a Christian, are you free to believe that Christ did not rise from the dead?

Or... if you believed that, could you no longer call yourself Christian?

How many who name the name of Christ are actually believers? :rolleyes: Enoch was a type of the raptured church and that was--one guy (Gen. 5:24). :rapture:

From rolling eyes to rolling heads, Christians are being persecuted now (1 Thess. 2:15; Rev. 12:13). Judgment starts with us :straight: and moves out into :banana: the world. :Popcorn:

And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all (Lk 17:26–29).

For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? 1 Pe 4:17–18

See:

The Great Tribulation – B (http://www.oneplace.com/ministries/walk-in-the-word/listen/the-great-tribulation-b-525420.html) by James MacDonald

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 06:48 PM
How many who name the name of Christ are actually believers? :rolleyes: Enoch was a type of the raptured church and that was--one guy (Gen. 5:24). :rapture:

If you believed that Christ did not rise from the dead, could you still call yourself Christian?

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 07:05 PM
If you believed that Christ did not rise from the dead, could you still call yourself Christian?

Everyone calls himself a Christian (Mt 7:22-23). :blabla: You will know them by their fruits (Mt 7:20). :sherlock:

I posted a paper that touches on this today: "Men must believe in a: physical, literal, bodily resurrection of Jesus..." Full text: My question relates to the various forms of our triune God... (http://www.vananne.com/applesofgold/My%20question%20relates%20to%20the%20various%20for ms%20of%20our%20triune%20God.pdf)

Recommended reading:

The Kingdom of the Cults (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_21?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=kingdom+of+the+cults+by+walter+martin&sprefix=kingdom+of+the+cults+%2Caps%2C425) by Walter Martin and Ravi Zacharias

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 07:08 PM
"Men must believe in a: physical, literal, bodily resurrection of Jesus..."

Agreed.

So someone who doesn't believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus would be wrong to call himself a Christian?

Calling oneself "Christian" implies certain beliefs, and excludes certain beliefs. Do you agree?

serpentdove
April 16th, 2016, 07:17 PM
Agreed. So someone who doesn't believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus would be wrong to call himself a Christian? He would be in error (Ga 5:9). He may or may not know that he errs: Evil people and impostors will become worse, deceiving and being deceived (2 Ti 3:12–13, emphasis mine). Many will be shocked--shocked to learn that they aren't the real deal. :burnlib:

"Going to church doesn't make you a Christian any more than going to a garage makes you an automobile." ~ Billy Sunday


Calling oneself "Christian" implies certain beliefs, and excludes certain beliefs. Do you agree? Yes, that's why I recommended the book. It helps to explain what beliefs put one outside the kingdom of God (Ga 5:9).

glassjester
April 16th, 2016, 07:28 PM
He would be in error (Ga 5:9).


Yes, that's why I recommended the book. It helps to explain what beliefs put one outside the kingdom of God (Ga 5:9).


Yes, I agree.
And there's nothing inherently wrong with a group having defining characteristics.
In fact, if it didn't, there would be no group to speak of.

If there weren't certain, specific beliefs that Christians did or didn't have, then calling oneself "Christian" would be completely meaningless.


...right?

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 07:53 PM
Agreed.

So someone who doesn't believe in the bodily resurrection of Jesus would be wrong to call himself a Christian?

Calling oneself "Christian" implies certain beliefs, and excludes certain beliefs. Do you agree?

Christians are supposed to be Jesus' followers.

So if you claim to be His follower or christian, you need to follow what He teaches.

It is not about what you claim. It is about His word.

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 07:55 PM
Jesus' teachings are in the books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John in the New Testament.

Do you know that?

Crucible
April 16th, 2016, 10:14 PM
you can trust what the pope says

The popes don't even trust what the popes say :rolleyes:

Cruciform
April 16th, 2016, 10:23 PM
The popes don't even trust what the popes say.
Proof, please.

Ben Masada
April 16th, 2016, 10:33 PM
Jesus' teachings are in the books of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John in the New Testament Do you know that?

Yes, I do but you don't. Jesus himself implied that his teaching were for the Jews and not for Gentiles. If you don't believe what I am saying, read Mat. 10:5,6. By the way, he implied that he had not come for the Gentiles but rather for the Jews. (Mat. 15:24)

Ben Masada
April 16th, 2016, 10:38 PM
If you believed that Christ did not rise from the dead, could you still call yourself Christian?

Yes, a Christian is not the one who believe that Jesus resurrected but that he was Christ. That's all one needs to be a Christian.

Ben Masada
April 16th, 2016, 10:46 PM
It's sad that you really have no idea what any of that actually means, however.

It's sad that you being in this forum for a long time, still don't know that we are here to teach each other what we don't know. If you know better than I do, what is taking you so long to tell us what things mean?

Sonnet
April 16th, 2016, 10:53 PM
Proof, please.

In the sense that, 'for all have sinned and fallen short of the glory =of God'.

meshak
April 16th, 2016, 10:57 PM
Yes, I do but you don't. Jesus himself implied that his teaching were for the Jews and not for Gentiles. If you don't believe what I am saying, read Mat. 10:5,6. By the way, he implied that he had not come for the Gentiles but rather for the Jews. (Mat. 15:24)

Stop addressing me you big liar.

I just reported you.

serpentdove
April 17th, 2016, 07:16 AM
...If there weren't certain, specific beliefs that Christians did or didn't have, then calling oneself "Christian" would be completely meaningless.


...right?:blabla: The term is meaningless today (Mt 7:20). :sherlock:

Cruciform
April 17th, 2016, 03:45 PM
In the sense that, 'for all have sinned and fallen short of the glory =of God'.
How do you imagine that this verse in any way supports the claim that "The popes don't even trust what the popes say"?