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Elia
November 17th, 2015, 09:49 PM
Bs"d

If only Christians could count to two....

The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that there is only one God:

Romans 3:30: "Seeing it is one God, …"

I Corinthians 8:4: "We know that an idol is nothing in the world and that there is no other God than one."

idem verse 6: "But to us there is but one God …"

Ephesians 4:6; "One God and father of all, …"

I Timothy 2:5; "For there is one God …"

And look what James says in James 2:19; "You believe that there is one God, and you do well."

And the fact of the matter is that a "God the Father" and a "god the son" is TWO (2) gods.

And not one.

And therefore Christianity is polytheism, and idolatry.

And saying 1 + 1 + 1 = 1 is not going to solve the matter.

At least not for those who are able to count to two.

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Derf
November 17th, 2015, 10:21 PM
Bs"d

If only Christians could count to two....

The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that there is only one God:

Romans 3:30: "Seeing it is one God, …"

I Corinthians 8:4: "We know that an idol is nothing in the world and that there is no other God than one."

idem verse 6: "But to us there is but one God …"

Ephesians 4:6; "One God and father of all, …"

I Timothy 2:5; "For there is one God …"

And look what James says in James 2:19; "You believe that there is one God, and you do well."

And the fact of the matter is that a "God the Father" and a "god the son" is TWO (2) gods.

And not one.

And therefore Christianity is polytheism, and idolatry.

And saying 1 + 1 + 1 = 1 is not going to solve the matter.

At least not for those who are able to count to two.

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Hi Elia,
Seems like God or Adam or Moses (not sure who the statement should be attributed to) couldn't count too good either. Gen 2:24. 1 man + 1 woman = 1. But at least we have the basic math laid out in the beginning for us. :)

glorydaz
November 17th, 2015, 10:38 PM
There is only One God. He is just much bigger than you think. If you knew Him, you would know this.

Elia
November 17th, 2015, 11:06 PM
Hi Elia,
Seems like God or Adam or Moses (not sure who the statement should be attributed to) couldn't count too good either. Gen 2:24. 1 man + 1 woman = 1. But at least we have the basic math laid out in the beginning for us. :)

Bs'd

"And they shall be one flesh" ..... In the Hebrew: "wehayu levasar echad" ..... This text is claimed by Christianity to prove that the word 'echad' can point to, or be, a 'composite unity', one being made up of more than one.

'Echad', one, can point to a composite unity. Of course. One can also point to a million: One million houses. Here one points to a million, but one is still one. We have here one million, and not a million millions. The fact that one points to something else does not change the meaning of one. One is one, and one stays one.

The claim that 'echad', one, can be a composite unity, with as proof the above verse, is simply wrong. In the above verse the flesh, made up of two people, is the composite unity, and not the 'echad', the one. Compare this to the following: One group of people. Here the group is the composite unity, and not the word one. We don't have here a composite unity of composite unities, but we have here one composite unity (the group of people). One is one and one stays one.

And last but not least; what Christianity does here, is comparing apples to steaks. The verse 'they will be one flesh' cannot be compared to 'God is one'. In the first verse the one is a number, telling us that there will be only one flesh. But in the second verse the one is not a number telling us that there is one God, here the one is an adjective, telling us that God IS one. (and not three) Here the one describes the essence of God, it doesn't give us the amount of Gods. Therefore you can not draw a conclusion from the first verse and apply it to the other.

And of course, Christianity must not forget that they not only have the battle with the Hebrew word 'echad', but also with the Greek word 'eis', also meaning one. In Mark 12:28-34 Jesus has a discussion with a scribe. The scribe asks Jesus what is the first (that is here 'most important', not first in order, because many commandments were given earlier) commandment, and Jesus answers: "Hear Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is one." Here Jesus quotes Deuteronomy 6:4. That is in the Greek: 'Kurios' (Lord) 'eis' (one) 'estin' (is). When he said this to the scribe the scribe answers him: "You are right teacher; you have truly said that he is one (eis), and there is no other then he." Upon this answers Jesus: "You are not far from the kingdom of God." So basically everybody agrees that God is one, except for the Christians. Therefore; the Christians must not only twist, deform, and corrupt the meaning of 'echad', meaning one, into three, but also the Greek word 'eis'. The question is of course: How often can you pull stunts like that, and still have some credibility left?



For Christianity it is literally a matter of life and death to obscure the fact that God is one, because when God is one, then He is not three, and then the trinity goes out the window and the Christians are exposed as the idol worshippers they are. Therefore also here many Bible translations are corrupted. This is the answer of the scribe to Jesus: “You have truly said that he is one, and there is no other then he." The scribe says: “HE IS ONE”. He does not say that there is one God, he says: “He (referring to God) IS ONE, and there is no other then he.” Take good notice that the scribe does not use the word “God”, the scribe refers to God with the word “He”. The word “God” does not appear in the answer of the scribe. But look now at some translations:

All versions of the King James: And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he: (why else “King James ONLY!)

Youngs literal translation: And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but He; Youngs literal translation is not so literal here…

Worldwide English: And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but He;

Gone is the fact that God is one, replaced by the fact that there is one God. Christianity can live with one God. One God who is three that is: God the Father, god the son, and god the holy ghost.

Christianity can’t live with one God who is one, like the Bible teaches. Therefore the translations are corrupted, in order to cover up the fact that God is one.

But honour to whom honour is due, there are modern day Christian translations who translate this in the right way:

New International Version: "Well said, teacher," the man replied. "You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him.” The word “God” should have been “He”, but the message is correct.

New American Standard Bible: The scribe said to Him, ""Right, Teacher; You have truly stated that he is one, and there is no one else beside him.

Revised Standard Version: And the scribe said to him, "You are right, Teacher; you have truly said that he is one, and there is no other but he;

Darby translation: And the scribe said to him, Right, teacher; thou hast spoken according to [the] truth. For he is one, and there is none other besides him;





Hear Israel, Y-H-W-H is our God, Y-H-W-H is ONE! Deuteronomy 6:4



All the nations may walk in the name of their gods; we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever! Micah 4:5

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Elia
November 17th, 2015, 11:08 PM
There is only One God.

Bs"d

There is only one God who is one.


He is just much bigger than you think. If you knew Him, you would know this.

God is great!

And God is one:



שמע ישראל י-ה-ו-ה אלהנו י-ה-ו-ה אחד

Hear Israel, Y-H-W-H is our God, Y-H-W-H is ONE.

And you shall love Y-H-W-H your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your might.
And these words which I command you this day shall be upon your heart;
and you shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, and when you walk by the way, and when you lie down, and when you rise.
And you shall bind them as a sign upon your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes.
And you shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.
Deut 6:4-9

The Jews until this day fulfill this commandment. Every morning they put upon their arm and upon their forehead their phylacteries, (prayer belts) that consist of black straps with black leather cubes, that contain parchment upon which is written this Biblical text that says that God is one. Upon the doorposts of the houses of the religious Jews there are small boxes or containers that also contain parchment upon which is written that God is one. During the morning and evening prayers the above text is recited which says that God is one.
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Derf
November 17th, 2015, 11:27 PM
Bs'd

"And they shall be one flesh" ..... In the Hebrew: "wehayu levasar echad" ..... This text is claimed by Christianity to prove that the word 'echad' can point to, or be, a 'composite unity', one being made up of more than one.

'Echad', one, can point to a composite unity. Of course. One can also point to a million: One million houses. Here one points to a million, but one is still one. We have here one million, and not a million millions. The fact that one points to something else does not change the meaning of one. One is one, and one stays one.

The claim that 'echad', one, can be a composite unity, with as proof the above verse, is simply wrong. In the above verse the flesh, made up of two people, is the composite unity, and not the 'echad', the one. Compare this to the following: One group of people. Here the group is the composite unity, and not the word one. We don't have here a composite unity of composite unities, but we have here one composite unity (the group of people). One is one and one stays one.

And last but not least; what Christianity does here, is comparing apples to steaks. The verse 'they will be one flesh' cannot be compared to 'God is one'. In the first verse the one is a number, telling us that there will be only one flesh. But in the second verse the one is not a number telling us that there is one God, here the one is an adjective, telling us that God IS one. (and not three) Here the one describes the essence of God, it doesn't give us the amount of Gods. Therefore you can not draw a conclusion from the first verse and apply it to the other.

And of course, Christianity must not forget that they not only have the battle with the Hebrew word 'echad', but also with the Greek word 'eis', also meaning one. In Mark 12:28-34 Jesus has a discussion with a scribe. The scribe asks Jesus what is the first (that is here 'most important', not first in order, because many commandments were given earlier) commandment, and Jesus answers: "Hear Israel, the Lord is our God, the Lord is one." Here Jesus quotes Deuteronomy 6:4. That is in the Greek: 'Kurios' (Lord) 'eis' (one) 'estin' (is). When he said this to the scribe the scribe answers him: "You are right teacher; you have truly said that he is one (eis), and there is no other then he." Upon this answers Jesus: "You are not far from the kingdom of God." So basically everybody agrees that God is one, except for the Christians. Therefore; the Christians must not only twist, deform, and corrupt the meaning of 'echad', meaning one, into three, but also the Greek word 'eis'. The question is of course: How often can you pull stunts like that, and still have some credibility left?



For Christianity it is literally a matter of life and death to obscure the fact that God is one, because when God is one, then He is not three, and then the trinity goes out the window and the Christians are exposed as the idol worshippers they are. Therefore also here many Bible translations are corrupted. This is the answer of the scribe to Jesus: “You have truly said that he is one, and there is no other then he." The scribe says: “HE IS ONE”. He does not say that there is one God, he says: “He (referring to God) IS ONE, and there is no other then he.” Take good notice that the scribe does not use the word “God”, the scribe refers to God with the word “He”. The word “God” does not appear in the answer of the scribe. But look now at some translations:

All versions of the King James: And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he: (why else “King James ONLY!)

Youngs literal translation: And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but He; Youngs literal translation is not so literal here…

Worldwide English: And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but He;

Gone is the fact that God is one, replaced by the fact that there is one God. Christianity can live with one God. One God who is three that is: God the Father, god the son, and god the holy ghost.

Christianity can’t live with one God who is one, like the Bible teaches. Therefore the translations are corrupted, in order to cover up the fact that God is one.

But honour to whom honour is due, there are modern day Christian translations who translate this in the right way:

New International Version: "Well said, teacher," the man replied. "You are right in saying that God is one and there is no other but him.” The word “God” should have been “He”, but the message is correct.

New American Standard Bible: The scribe said to Him, ""Right, Teacher; You have truly stated that he is one, and there is no one else beside him.

Revised Standard Version: And the scribe said to him, "You are right, Teacher; you have truly said that he is one, and there is no other but he;

Darby translation: And the scribe said to him, Right, teacher; thou hast spoken according to [the] truth. For he is one, and there is none other besides him;





Hear Israel, Y-H-W-H is our God, Y-H-W-H is ONE! Deuteronomy 6:4



All the nations may walk in the name of their gods; we will walk in the name of Y-H-W-H our God for ever and ever! Micah 4:5

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What about the beginning of the chapter (Mark 12:1-10), where the tenants took the Lord's son and killed him? Have you rejected the stone that has become the chief corner, Elia? I pray you won't do so for long.
Blessings

Elia
November 18th, 2015, 05:55 AM
What about the beginning of the chapter (Mark 12:1-10), where the tenants took the Lord's son and killed him? Have you rejected the stone that has become the chief corner, Elia? I pray you won't do so for long.
Blessings

Bs'd

Christianity introduced a new "man-god", that nobody ever heard of before.

Therefore they had to change God who is one into God who is three.

And since we know that there is only one God, Y-H-W-H, therefore we know that the NT leads to idolatry:

“If there arises among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams, and he gives you a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder comes to pass, of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods’—which you have not known—‘and let us serve them,’ you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams, for Y-H-W-H your God is testing you to know whether you love Y-H-W-H your God with all your heart and with all your soul. You shall walk after Y-H-W-H your God and fear Him, and keep His commandments and obey His voice; you shall serve Him and hold fast to Him. But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has spoken in order to turn you away from Y-H-W-H your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of bondage, to entice you from the way in which Y-H-W-H your God commanded you to walk. So you shall put away the evil from your midst.

If anyone secretly entices you—even if it is your brother, your father’s son or your mother’s son, or your own son or daughter, or the wife you embrace, or your most intimate friend—saying, “Let us go worship other gods,” whom neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7*any of the gods of the peoples that are around you, whether near you or far away from you, from one end of the earth to the other, 8*you must not yield to or heed any such persons. Show them no pity or compassion and do not shield them. 9*But you shall surely kill them; your own hand shall be first against them to execute them, and afterwards the hand of all the people. 10*Stone them to death for trying to turn you away from Y-H-W-H your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. 11*Then all Israel shall hear and be afraid, and never again do any such wickedness."
Deut 13.
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Truster
November 18th, 2015, 07:16 AM
Man is also one, but is made up of three. Body, soul and spirit. This is the likeness as opposed to the image. Our likeness is being triune as is the Eternal Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Elia
November 18th, 2015, 07:36 AM
Man is also one, but is made up of three. Body, soul and spirit.

Bs'd

Hmmm.... What is the difference between soul and spirit?


This is the likeness as opposed to the image. Our likeness is being triune as is the Eternal Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Interesting theory. The only problem is that that theory goes right against what the Bible teaches us, namely that God is one. And when God is one, then He is not made up of three.

Nice try though. .
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Nick M
November 18th, 2015, 07:55 AM
The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that there is only one God:



Who said otherwise? As for your attempt to blaspheme....

And God said, Let us make man according to our image and likeness

nikolai_42
November 18th, 2015, 08:00 AM
And the Lord appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant:
Genesis 18:1-3

Do you think Abraham knew (assuming the distinction was necessary) which one was actually the LORD (noting that Abraham acted and spoke first in response to the appearance of these three men)?

EDIT : And if no man can see God and live (Exodus 33:20), who was this Abraham was seeing and bowing to?

Derf
November 18th, 2015, 08:19 AM
Bs'd

Christianity introduced a new "man-god", that nobody ever heard of before.

Therefore they had to change God who is one into God who is three.

And since we know that there is only one God, Y-H-W-H, therefore we know that the NT leads to idolatry:

“If there arises among you a prophet or a dreamer of dreams, and he gives you a sign or a wonder, and the sign or the wonder comes to pass, of which he spoke to you, saying, ‘Let us go after other gods’—which you have not known—‘and let us serve them,’ you shall not listen to the words of that prophet or that dreamer of dreams, for Y-H-W-H your God is testing you to know whether you love Y-H-W-H your God with all your heart and with all your soul. You shall walk after Y-H-W-H your God and fear Him, and keep His commandments and obey His voice; you shall serve Him and hold fast to Him. But that prophet or that dreamer of dreams shall be put to death, because he has spoken in order to turn you away from Y-H-W-H your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt and redeemed you from the house of bondage, to entice you from the way in which Y-H-W-H your God commanded you to walk. So you shall put away the evil from your midst.

If anyone secretly entices you—even if it is your brother, your father’s son or your mother’s son, or your own son or daughter, or the wife you embrace, or your most intimate friend—saying, “Let us go worship other gods,” whom neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7*any of the gods of the peoples that are around you, whether near you or far away from you, from one end of the earth to the other, 8*you must not yield to or heed any such persons. Show them no pity or compassion and do not shield them. 9*But you shall surely kill them; your own hand shall be first against them to execute them, and afterwards the hand of all the people. 10*Stone them to death for trying to turn you away from Y-H-W-H your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. 11*Then all Israel shall hear and be afraid, and never again do any such wickedness."
Deut 13.
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Hi Elia,
You were quoting the gospel of Mark as if it were authoritative. If so, then how do you deal with the idea that Jesus was foretelling his own execution and blaming the leaders of his day for killing the owner's son? Either the gospel of Mark is authoritative or it's not. If it's not, then I could understand why you would ignore it completely, but if it is, then you have a lot of things to contend with in terms of the nature of Jesus. At the very least, you need to decide if he was the messiah, and if so, then you need to believe in him for salvation. Whether you think he was God or not seems irrelevant until that's settled.

The messiah was promised and eagerly anticipated by the Jews because of the descriptions and prophecies in the scriptures, and Jesus makes a claim--a very substantial claim that Jerusalem would be destroyed because the Jews would reject HIM as messiah.

jamie
November 18th, 2015, 08:30 AM
Bs'd
Hmmm.... What is the difference between soul and spirit?


A soul is a body with spirit. When a body dies the spirit returns to God who gave it.

Elia
November 18th, 2015, 12:05 PM
Who said otherwise? As for your attempt to blaspheme....

And God said, Let us make man according to our image and likeness

Bs'd

Genesis 1:26; "Let us make man" If anybody finds in a text the word "us", would any normal person assume that it refers to one person with a multi-personality disorder? Of course not.

But why then, when Christians see the word "us" in the Bible, do they think that?

Gen 1:26 is used as a 'proof' that there is more than one God, or one God who is not one, eventhough the Bible clearly teaches that there is only one God who is one. and despite the fact that there are several other valid explanations for the plural word "us". One explanation is that it is a majestic plural as used by kings. Another possible explanation is that God was talking to the angels.

Some Christians try to refute the last argument by saying that the angels didn't create. They point to Genesis 1:1; "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." They say: 'God was the creator, and not the angels.' However, it is a given in Jewish law that an emissary is equal to the one who sends him. When a Jewish man marries a woman through an agent, the legal effect is the same as when he marries her personally. A good Biblical example of this is to be found in Genesis 19 where is spoken about the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah. God sent two angels to destroy the cities, the angels said to Lot in verse 13: "For we are about to destroy this place, because the outcry against its people has become great before the LORD, and the LORD has sent us to destroy it." Upon this Lot says to his sons in law: "Up, get out of this place; for the LORD is about to destroy the city." Lot didn't say: "The angels are going to destroy the city" He said: "The LORD (Y-H-W-H in the Hebrew text) is going to destroy the city". And in verse 29 it is written: "So it was that, when God destroyed the cities of the valley...." So the angels were send by God to destroy the cities, but God is considered to be the one who did it, because He was the one who sent them. So why shouldn't the same hold true for the creation?

But one way or the other, no plural created man. Look in Genesis 5:1; "When God created man ..." In Hebrew this is: "bara Elohiem adam" Here the verb "to create", in Hebrew "bara", is in the singular, indicating clearly that Elohiem who created man is one. The same goes for the very first verse of the Bible: "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." The word created is here written in the singular; it says "bara". If God was a plural, it should have been "baru".

BUT, back to the pronouns, Y-H-W-H says the following:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

It says "I" am Y-H-W-H. And, as we all know, "I" is singular, and not plural, and therefore no three persons in Y-H-W-H. Otherwise He would have said: "WE are Y-H-W-H."

But no such thing, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H".

No trinity.

Another example of a pronoun:

Nehemiah 9:6 “You alone are Y-H-W-H.”

As we see, it says that YOU, in the Hebrew singular, not plural are Y-H-W-H.

Again, no YOU, plural, are Y-H-W-H, but YOU singular, are Y-H-W-H.

So no three persons in God.

Another one:

Isaiah 44:6 “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: I am the first and I am the last; apart from me there is no God.”

Clear what? It doesn't say: “This is what Y-H-W-H says- Israel's King and Redeemer, Y-H-W-H Almighty: WE are the first and WE are the last; apart from US there is no God.”

No such a thing, it is all SINGULAR.

Another one:

Joel 2:27 “Then you will know that I am in Israel, that I am Y-H-W-H your God, and that there is no other;”

Again, God says: "I am Y-H-W-H", and not "WE are Y-H-W-H" Such a thing simply doesn't exist.

I can go on and on with this, but these examples suffice. There is NO plurality in God.

And the word "us" when God speaks to the angels, does not imply otherwise..
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Elia
November 18th, 2015, 12:07 PM
And the Lord appeared unto him in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
And he lift up his eyes and looked, and, lo, three men stood by him: and when he saw them, he ran to meet them from the tent door, and bowed himself toward the ground,
And said, My Lord, if now I have found favour in thy sight, pass not away, I pray thee, from thy servant:
Genesis 18:1-3

Do you think Abraham knew (assuming the distinction was necessary) which one was actually the LORD (noting that Abraham acted and spoke first in response to the appearance of these three men)?

EDIT : And if no man can see God and live (Exodus 33:20), who was this Abraham was seeing and bowing to?

Bs'd

Just read the beginning of chapter 19 of Genesis, and you see that at least two of the men were angels.

So no "God in three men".

Elia
November 18th, 2015, 12:11 PM
Hi Elia,
You were quoting the gospel of Mark as if it were authoritative. If so, then how do you deal with the idea that Jesus was foretelling his own execution and blaming the leaders of his day for killing the owner's son? Either the gospel of Mark is authoritative or it's not. If it's not, then I could understand why you would ignore it completely, but if it is, then you have a lot of things to contend with in terms of the nature of Jesus. At the very least, you need to decide if he was the messiah,

Bs"d

He was not the messiah, because he didn't fulfil the messianic prophecies.

And we don't need him for salvation, for that we need God, and the NT is not authoritative

achduke
November 18th, 2015, 12:32 PM
Bs'd

Just read the beginning of chapter 19 of Genesis, and you see that at least two of the men were angels.

So no "God in three men".

Proverbs 8:22-36
22 “The Lord possessed me at the beginning of His way, before His works of old.
23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
24 When there were no depths I was brought forth, when there were no fountains abounding with water.
25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth,
26 while as yet He had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the first parts of dust of the world.
27 When He prepared the heavens, I was there; when He set a compass upon the face of the deep,
28 when He established the clouds above, when He strengthened the fountains of the deep,
29 when He gave to the sea His decree that the waters should not pass His commandment, when He appointed the foundations of the earth”
30 then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him, and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him,
31 rejoicing in the habitable part of His earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
32 “Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children, for blessed are they that keep my ways.
33 Hear instruction and be wise, and refuse it not.
34 Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.
35 For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain the favor of the Lord.
36 But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul; all they that hate me love death.”

1 Corinthians 6:19-20
19 What? Know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you and which ye have from God, and that ye are not your own?
20 For ye are bought with a price. Therefore glorify God in your body and in your spirit, which are God’s.


John 2:21 But He spoke of the temple of His body.


Zechariah 3:6-10
6 And the angel of the Lord protested unto Joshua, saying,
7 “Thus saith the Lord of hosts: ‘If thou wilt walk in My ways, and if thou wilt keep My ordinance, then thou shalt also judge My house, and shalt also keep My courts, and I will give thee places to walk among these who stand by.
8 Hear now, O Joshua the high priest, thou and thy fellows who sit before thee; for they are men wondered at. For behold, I will bring forth My Servant the Branch.
9 For behold the stone that I have laid before Joshua: upon one stone shall be seven eyes. Behold, I will engrave the engraving thereof,’ saith the Lord of hosts, ‘and I will remove the iniquity of that land in one day.
10 In that day,’ saith the Lord of hosts, ‘shall ye call every man his neighbor under the vine and under the fig tree.’”

Revelation 5:6
6 And I beheld, and lo, in the midst of the throne and the four living beings, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God, sent forth into all the earth.

genuineoriginal
November 18th, 2015, 12:36 PM
Bs"d

If only Christians could count to two....

The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that there is only one God:

Romans 3:30: "Seeing it is one God, …"

I Corinthians 8:4: "We know that an idol is nothing in the world and that there is no other God than one."

idem verse 6: "But to us there is but one God …"

Ephesians 4:6; "One God and father of all, …"

I Timothy 2:5; "For there is one God …"

And look what James says in James 2:19; "You believe that there is one God, and you do well."

And the fact of the matter is that a "God the Father" and a "god the son" is TWO (2) gods.

And not one.

And therefore Christianity is polytheism, and idolatry.

And saying 1 + 1 + 1 = 1 is not going to solve the matter.

At least not for those who are able to count to two.

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John 4:23
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

patrick jane
November 18th, 2015, 12:41 PM
Bs'd

Just read the beginning of chapter 19 of Genesis, and you see that at least two of the men were angels.

So no "God in three men".

So which is it - YHWH OR JHWH in your signature ?

Truster
November 18th, 2015, 01:05 PM
Bs'd

Hmmm.... What is the difference between soul and spirit?



Interesting theory. The only problem is that that theory goes right against what the Bible teaches us, namely that God is one. And when God is one, then He is not made up of three.

Nice try though. .
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You don't know the difference between soul and spirit?

Pray tell what the words, image and likeness mean then....if you insist that I am wrong.

Derf
November 18th, 2015, 01:51 PM
Bs"d

He was not the messiah, because he didn't fulfil the messianic prophecies.

And we don't need him for salvation, for that we need God, and the NT is not authoritative

Ok, then it doesn't seem like it's worthwhile to quote selectively from the book of Mark.

What can you tell me about the messiah from the Old Testament? Is there a need for a messiah at all? If not for salvation, what would be his purpose?

nikolai_42
November 18th, 2015, 01:54 PM
Bs'd

Just read the beginning of chapter 19 of Genesis, and you see that at least two of the men were angels.

So no "God in three men".

So how did Abraham know who was who? And how does this conform to not seeing God and living?

heir
November 18th, 2015, 02:22 PM
Bs"d

If only Christians could count to two....:listen:

If only you believed what you read in the Bible!

1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

God's Truth
November 18th, 2015, 02:24 PM
Bs"d

If only Christians could count to two....

The whole Bible, even the NT, teaches that there is only one God:

Romans 3:30: "Seeing it is one God, …"

I Corinthians 8:4: "We know that an idol is nothing in the world and that there is no other God than one."

idem verse 6: "But to us there is but one God …"

Ephesians 4:6; "One God and father of all, …"

I Timothy 2:5; "For there is one God …"

And look what James says in James 2:19; "You believe that there is one God, and you do well."

And the fact of the matter is that a "God the Father" and a "god the son" is TWO (2) gods.

And not one.

And therefore Christianity is polytheism, and idolatry.

And saying 1 + 1 + 1 = 1 is not going to solve the matter.

At least not for those who are able to count to two.

.
.
.
.


That is right, there is only One God.

Jesus is that one God the Father come in the flesh.

Nick M
November 18th, 2015, 04:33 PM
Jesus is that one God the Father come in the flesh.

Jesus is not the Father. Jesus is God. The Father is God. There is one God. You don't have to understand it, just believe it.

Sherman
November 18th, 2015, 05:03 PM
Do not open any more of these threads. There were 300 + of these threads on TOL. I removed over 100 of them to conserve server space.