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Robert Pate
October 1st, 2015, 08:03 AM
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place" Acts 2:1.

The word must have gotten out that God was going to reveal some great thing to the apostles that he had never revealed to them before. People came from all over that part of the world to see and to hear what this was, Acts 2:9-11.

What happened next was one of the most amazing events in human history. A sound from heaven as of a rushing wind that filled the house where they were sitting. Cloven tongues like fire sat upon each one of them and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues, Acts 2:2-4.

Whatever God was going to reveal to the apostles must be very important for there to be such a demonstration of the Holy Spirit such as this.

"Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues THE WONDERFUL WORKS OF GOD" Acts 2:11. The wonderful works of God is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It is the Gospel that justifies ungodly sinners, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

This message preached by Peter on the day of Pentecost literally turned Jerusalem upside down. Thousand heard and believed the Gospel and were saved, Acts 2:41, Acts 4:4. It was the Gospel message that gave birth to the New Testament church. "Faith came by hearing and hearing by the Gospel of Jesus Christ" Romans 10:17.

No one was predestinated to hear and believe this Gospel message. Some that heard the Gospel and believed it had participated in the crucifixon of Christ, Acts 2:36. Jerusalem was never the same after the day of Pentecost. The scripture says that the apostles went everywhere preaching the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Acts 4:2. They did not preach the death or the crucifixon of Christ, they preached the resurrection.

Pentecostals need to take note that nothing, absolutly nothing was said about the Pentecost experience of the sound of the rushing wind or the tongues experience. The apostles had a much greater message than that. The had the Gospel of Jesus Christ. They had the Gospel that is the power of God unto salvation, Romans 1:16. They had the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

fishrovmen
October 1st, 2015, 02:42 PM
They were probably getting together to worship. No wonder you don't understand it. And yes, amazing things DO happen during a worship service.

RBBI
October 1st, 2015, 03:58 PM
They were getting together because it was required of all males to appear 3 times in the year for the 3 main moed's (divine appointments) of which Shavuot was one of them.

And yes they did talk about what happened that day, read Acts again, not to mention about the gifts of the Spirit in Corinthians, ect.

Yeshua came to reverse all the curses, and included the confusion of tongues from the tower of Babel. HaShem restored what was lost. Peace

Robert Pate
October 1st, 2015, 04:59 PM
They were probably getting together to worship. No wonder you don't understand it. And yes, amazing things DO happen during a worship service.

So you think that this was nothing more than a worship service?

Robert Pate
October 1st, 2015, 05:04 PM
They were getting together because it was required of all males to appear 3 times in the year for the 3 main moed's (divine appointments) of which Shavuot was one of them.

And yes they did talk about what happened that day, read Acts again, not to mention about the gifts of the Spirit in Corinthians, ect.

Yeshua came to reverse all the curses, and included the confusion of tongues from the tower of Babel. HaShem restored what was lost. Peace

There is no mention of what happened on the day of Pentecost. Please show scripture. All of the gifts of the Holy Spirit were given to further the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

This is what Acts is all about. It is about how God used many various means to take the Gospel of Jesus Christ to the world.

RBBI
October 1st, 2015, 08:19 PM
There is no mention of what happened on the day of Pentecost. Please show scripture. All of the gifts of the Holy Spirit were given to further the Gospel of Jesus Christ.

This is what Acts is all about. It is about how God used many various means to take the Gospel of Jesus Christ to the world.

I'm not following you.

Acts means works, the Holy Ghost does the works, acts is about the works the disciples did after being imbued with the power from on high, which they waited on in the upper room. Corinthians discusses what those works are and to some extent how they operate. Peace

Robert Pate
October 1st, 2015, 08:40 PM
I'm not following you.

Acts means works, the Holy Ghost does the works, acts is about the works the disciples did after being imbued with the power from on high, when they waited on in the upper room. Corinthians discusses what those works are and to some extent how they operate. Peace

The Holy Spirit does not do works. The Holy Spirit prompts the Christian to do good works.

The Gospel came into the world in the power of the Holy Spirit and indwelt those who heard and believed the Gospel.

RBBI
October 2nd, 2015, 07:27 AM
I think you need to look at the characteristics of the new church a little closer. It appears to me you have skipped one of the two baptism Yeshua said was necessary to fulfill ALL righteousness.

Luk 12:12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

Notice that He teaches you. That's a work.

1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Heb 2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

Jde 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

He teaches, He gives operates spiritual gifts, He prays through us. Those are works. Peace

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 08:48 AM
I think you need to look at the characteristics of the new church a little closer. It appears to me you have skipped one of the two baptism Yeshua said was necessary to fulfill ALL righteousness.

Luk 12:12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

Notice that He teaches you. That's a work.

1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Heb 2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

Jde 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

He teaches, He gives operates spiritual gifts, He prays through us. Those are works. Peace

Is it you that is posting this comment or is it the Holy Spirit?

I think that it is you, because the Holy Spirit does not speak of himself, John 16:13.

fishrovmen
October 2nd, 2015, 10:15 AM
I think you need to look at the characteristics of the new church a little closer. It appears to me you have skipped one of the two baptism Yeshua said was necessary to fulfill ALL righteousness.

Luk 12:12 For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say.

Notice that He teaches you. That's a work.

1Co 2:13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

Heb 2:4 God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

Jde 1:20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,

He teaches, He gives operates spiritual gifts, He prays through us. Those are works. Peace

Robert doesnt believe that God is active in this world. No miracles, no extraordinary power or events

Right Divider
October 2nd, 2015, 10:34 AM
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place" Acts 2:1.

The word must have gotten out that God was going to reveal some great thing to the apostles that he had never revealed to them before. People came from all over that part of the world to see and to hear what this was, Acts 2:9-11.
Pentecost was one of the three times per year that all Israelites were required BY LAW to travel to Jerusalem. They were there EVERY YEAR.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 11:23 AM
Robert doesnt believe that God is active in this world. No miracles, no extraordinary power or events


This is the age of faith and grace.

The greatest miracle that the world can ever imagine has already happened in the incarnation and Gospel of Jesus Christ.

The next great miracle and event will be the return of Jesus.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 11:24 AM
Pentecost was one of the three times per year that all Israelites were required BY LAW to travel to Jerusalem. They were there EVERY YEAR.

Sure, but this time it was different.

Right Divider
October 2nd, 2015, 11:40 AM
Sure, but this time it was different.
They were not there "because word got around".


The word must have gotten out that God was going to reveal some great thing to the apostles that he had never revealed to them before. People came from all over that part of the world to see and to hear what this was, Acts 2:9-11 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/Acts%202.9-11).There were certainly prophecies about this day, but scripture does not point to any special "word going around" as you seem to suggest here.

Everything that happened was all perfectly in line with all that the prophets said would happen someday regarding Israel.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 11:49 AM
They were not there "because word got around".

There were certainly prophecies about this day, but scripture does not point to any special "word going around" as you seem to suggest here.

Everything that happened was all perfectly in line with all that the prophets said would happen someday regarding Israel.

So, you think that what happened on the day of Pentecost happened without any clue? Surprise! here comes the Gospel. That is not how the Lord does things.

RBBI
October 2nd, 2015, 12:38 PM
Is it you that is posting this comment or is it the Holy Spirit?

I think that it is you, because the Holy Spirit does not speak of himself, John 16:13.

I didn't speak of myself, unless you mean the "I think" at the beginning of the post. And I still think it, and it appears I was not incorrect. There are two baptisms to be baptized with you've neglected one of them, which is why you can't see the kingdom. Don't wait. Time is almost up. Peace

Jhn 1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.

Jhn 7:39 (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified.)

Water baptism = being baptized into the likeness of His death.
Holy Ghost baptism = being baptized into the likeness of His life.

The first, an infilling, which is symbolized by the inner gold lining on the Ark of the Covenant. The second, symbolized by the outer gold lining on the same Ark. The wood they cover, is symbolic of our humanity. See that ye make it according to the pattern shown ye on the mount. Peace

RBBI
October 2nd, 2015, 12:42 PM
Robert doesnt believe that God is active in this world. No miracles, no extraordinary power or events

I see. Well, then he'd be wrong, wouldn't he?

I've had miracle healings, and prayed for people to receive them and they did. That is one of the benefits of the covenant and should be the expectation of the believer. Jehovah Jireh, He heals. Peace

Right Divider
October 2nd, 2015, 01:21 PM
So, you think that what happened on the day of Pentecost happened without any clue? Surprise! here comes the Gospel. That is not how the Lord does things.
No Robert, that is NOT what I said.

What I said was that it was not a "word got around" thing has you had suggested. Also, it was NOT a surprise either.... as it had been foretold in scripture and by THEIR prophets.

I was pointing your post sounded as though some "word got out". The events of that DAY were all foretold in scripture. That is how God does things with Israel.

dialm
October 2nd, 2015, 02:27 PM
Were any of the people who were filled with the Holy Spirit on that day ultimately lost?

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 04:58 PM
Were any of the people who were filled with the Holy Spirit on that day ultimately lost?


Not if they received and believed the Gospel.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 05:00 PM
I see. Well, then he'd be wrong, wouldn't he?

I've had miracle healings, and prayed for people to receive them and they did. That is one of the benefits of the covenant and should be the expectation of the believer. Jehovah Jireh, He heals. Peace

No miracles today.

Only the ones that you fabricate in your head.

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:10 PM
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place" Acts 2:1.

The word must have gotten out that God was going to reveal some great thing to the apostles that he had never revealed to them before. People came from all over that part of the world to see and to hear what this was, Acts 2:9-11.

What happened next was one of the most amazing events in human history. A sound from heaven as of a rushing wind that filled the house where they were sitting. Cloven tongues like fire sat upon each one of them and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues, Acts 2:2-4.

Whatever God was going to reveal to the apostles must be very important for there to be such a demonstration of the Holy Spirit such as this.

"Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues THE WONDERFUL WORKS OF GOD" Acts 2:11. The wonderful works of God is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It is the Gospel that justifies ungodly sinners, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

This message preached by Peter on the day of Pentecost literally turned Jerusalem upside down. Thousand heard and believed the Gospel and were saved, Acts 2:41, Acts 4:4. It was the Gospel message that gave birth to the New Testament church. "Faith came by hearing and hearing by the Gospel of Jesus Christ" Romans 10:17.

No one was predestinated to hear and believe this Gospel message. Some that heard the Gospel and believed it had participated in the crucifixon of Christ, Acts 2:36. Jerusalem was never the same after the day of Pentecost. The scripture says that the apostles went everywhere preaching the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Acts 4:2. They did not preach the death or the crucifixon of Christ, they preached the resurrection.

Pentecostals need to take note that nothing, absolutly nothing was said about the Pentecost experience of the sound of the rushing wind or the tongues experience. The apostles had a much greater message than that. The had the Gospel of Jesus Christ. They had the Gospel that is the power of God unto salvation, Romans 1:16. They had the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

Piffle

The proof of what they preached is in the assemblies they established, whether Jerusalem or Galatia or Corinth, we see signs and wonders, miracles, healings, exorcisms, prophecies, tongues and interpretations.

Paul said I didn't come like Pate with wisdom of man but I came with the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost.

You only preach part of the gospel, you keep back a large part.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 05:21 PM
Piffle

The proof of what they preached is in the assemblies they established, whether Jerusalem or Galatia or Corinth, we see signs and wonders, miracles, healings, exorcisms, prophecies, tongues and interpretations.

Paul said I didn't come like Pate with wisdom of man but I came with the power and demonstration of the Holy Ghost.

You only preach part of the gospel, you keep back a large part.

The greatest miracle since the history of the world has already happen. The incarnation of Jesus Christ.

No need for miracles, signs, visions, healings today. We now have the full revelation of Christ and his Gospel in the New Testament.

There are no new messages. The only time God does miracles is when he is communicating some new message.

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:22 PM
If the western church had what they had the people would be beating the doors down to get into church

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 05:27 PM
If the western church had what they had the people would be beating the doors down to get into church

And they would probably turn out to be Gospel rejecting, counterfeit Christians.

"The Just Shall Live By Faith" Not by miracles.

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:28 PM
The greatest miracle since the history of the world has already happen. The incarnation of Jesus Christ.

No need for miracles, signs, visions, healings today. We now have the full revelation of Christ and his Gospel in the New Testament.

There are no new messages. The only time God does miracles is when he is communicating some new message.

You are talking nonsense my dear Pate

It is the New Testament which describes the assemblies formed by Paul under the Holy Ghost. When they met one had a psalm or a reading or a revelation or a prophecy or a message in tongues or an interpretation...there were gifts of healing, miracles.

Paul said covet the greater gifts, that's in the new testament which you say is perfect.

You saying the writing down of Paul's doctrine was more perfect than when he physically spoke the word?

How come if the perfect came the church slipped into 1500 years of utter darkness?

Wick Stick
October 2nd, 2015, 05:31 PM
The Holy Spirit does not do works. The Holy Spirit prompts the Christian to do good works.
"The nerves in the arm do not move the arm. They only prompt the muscles to move the arm."

I guess it's true. It's an oddly specific differentiation, though. Big picture: the arm moves.

Likewise... Apostles. Spirit. All part of the workings of the Mighty Arm of the Lord.

Jarrod

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 05:35 PM
You are talking nonsense my dear Pate

It is the New Testament which describes the assemblies formed by Paul under the Holy Ghost. When they met one had a psalm or a reading or a revelation or a prophecy or a message in tongues or an interpretation...there were gifts of healing, miracles.

Paul said covet the greater gifts, that's in the new testament which you say is perfect.

You saying the writing down of Paul's doctrine was more perfect than when he physically spoke the word?

How come if the perfect came the church slipped into 1500 years of utter darkness?


The whole point of the book of Acts is that the apostles were taking the Gospel into the world.

God was using many various methods to get the Gospel of his Son out into the world. Tongues, healings, miracles, etc.

But with the full revelation of Christ and his Gospel in the New Testament all of that has ceased.

The New Testament church is alive and well.

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:42 PM
And they would probably turn out to be Gospel rejecting, counterfeit Christians.

"The Just Shall Live By Faith" Not by miracles.

You are being foolish on so many levels....You need faith in order to have miracles, Jesus said the reason the disciples failed was because of unbelief.

So if somebody cries for salvation and are saved and can be seen to be saved...this is unbelief according to you.

You my dear friend live by miracles, it's just that you [like the lepers] do not give thanks for it, you draw breath by a miracle...the supper on your table is a miracle.

No doubt you credit the politicians and the money moguls for everything you have.

Did the people swarm Peter because He did miracles? because they heard the miracle of tongues ? did thousands thereby hear the gospel and so get saved? did the church multiply daily?

The same thing is happening in China today...whole provinces....is their faith real? go and ask the ones who have been tortured in the labour camps for up to 20 years

The west needs to wake the heck up

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:46 PM
The whole point of the book of Acts is that the apostles were taking the Gospel into the world.

God was using many various methods to get the Gospel of his Son out into the world. Tongues, healings, miracles, etc.

But with the full revelation of Christ and his Gospel in the New Testament all of that has ceased.

The New Testament church is alive and well.

This is perfect nonsense for it is the New Testament which speaks about the power and manifestations of the Holy Spirit.

"Does God do miracles among you by works of the law or by hearing with faith?" Paul asked

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 05:48 PM
God hasn't changed my friend YOU have changed.

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 05:52 PM
You are being foolish on so many levels....You need faith in order to have miracles, Jesus said the reason the disciples failed was because of unbelief.

So if somebody cries for salvation and are saved and can be seen to be saved...this is unbelief according to you.

You my dear friend live by miracles, it's just that you [like the lepers] do not give thanks for it, you draw breath by a miracle...the supper on your table is a miracle.

No doubt you credit the politicians and the money moguls for everything you have.

Did the people swarm Peter because He did miracles? because they heard the miracle of tongues ? did thousands thereby hear the gospel and so get saved? did the church multiply daily?

The same thing is happening in China today...whole provinces....is their faith real? go and ask the ones who have been tortured in the labour camps for up to 20 years

The west needs to wake the heck up


If God is doing miracles today then the Bible is not a closed book.

This is the age of grace and faith. I don't want miracles. The anti-Christ will do miracles, Revelation 13:13, 14. You will probably be deceived by him.

RBBI
October 2nd, 2015, 05:53 PM
No miracles today.

Only the ones that you fabricate in your head.

Uh no....mine were well documented with physicians, the whole of whom said, "We have no other explanation for what has happened other than the one you gave us." In short, Yeshua did it.

By your skewed reasoning, there are two covenants, one for the early church, and one for the ones that came after. That would make Him a respecter of persons, which I can assure you He is not. The soul is the candle of the Lord; yours needs to be "lit", with tongues (flames) of fire. Seek it while it is still available........Peace

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 06:00 PM
Uh no....mine were well documented with physicians, the whole of whom said, "We have no other explanation for what has happened other than the one you gave us." In short, Yeshua did it.

By your skewed reasoning, there are two covenants, one for the early church, and one for the ones that came after. That would make Him a respecter of persons, which I can assure you He is not. The soul is the candle of the Lord; yours needs to be "lit", with tongues (flames) of fire. Seek it while it is still available........Peace

Was your miracle internal? They always are and they are always fraudulent.

I will pay a large sum of money for proof of a restored limb that has been amputated through an accident.

Before and after photos only please.

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 06:00 PM
If God is doing miracles today then the Bible is not a closed book.

This is the age of grace and faith. I don't want miracles. The anti-Christ will do miracles, Revelation 13:13, 14. You will probably be deceived by him.

Miracles happen in response to bible faith, it is because you don't have the faith in scripture that those folk had that you see no miracles.

Faith in what?

Did somebody tell you "He bore your sins?" you believed it and received remission of sins.

The same scripture tells you "He hath borne our diseases and carried our sickness"

You didn't hear that part, it wasn't preached to you, so you never believed it.

It all comes from scripture bud

Nanja
October 2nd, 2015, 06:01 PM
No one was predestinated to hear and believe this Gospel message. Some that heard the Gospel and believed it had participated in the crucifixon of Christ, Acts 2:36.


False statement!

All of God's Election of Grace Rom. 11:5 were Chosen and Predestinated in Christ to receive
the Adoption of Sons and an Eternal Inheritance before the foundation of the world Eph. 1:4-11.
And their Election had nothing to do with any works they shall or shall not do, but strictly by
the Grace of God given them, according to His Purpose and Grace, before the world began 2 Tim. 1:9.

Spiritual ability to Hear God's Word and Believe in Him are God-given, and are evidence of Spiritual Life in Christ:
They were given a New Heart Ezek. 36:26-27: Born Again!

John 5:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me,
hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Spiritual Hearing Prov. 20:12 and the ability to believe in Christ Phil. 1:29 are works God does in His Chosen Sons.

But they are not acts that a person, who is still in the flesh, can take credit for by exercising his own free will Rom. 8:8l!

That's just filthy rags Is. 64:6!

~~~~~

Robert Pate
October 2nd, 2015, 06:04 PM
Miracles happen in response to bible faith, it is because you don't have the faith in scripture that those folk had that you see no miracles.

Faith in what?

Did somebody tell you "He bore your sins?" you believed it and received remission of sins.

The same scripture tells you "He hath borne our diseases and carried our sickness"

You didn't hear that part, it wasn't preached to you, so you never believed it.

It all comes from scripture bud


You apparently want to see a miracle, because you don't have faith.

Wick Stick
October 2nd, 2015, 06:07 PM
Miracles don't preclude faith; they require it.

If someone understood what happened, that might preclude faith. But then it wouldn't be a miracle, would it?

Jarrod

RBBI
October 2nd, 2015, 06:09 PM
Was your miracle internal? They always are and they are always fraudulent.

I will pay a large sum of money for proof of a restored limb that has been amputated through an accident.

Before and after photos only please.

Sorry Thomas, no severed limbs. But a completely crushed elbow joint restored might count, as it was "lame" and then it wasn't, and all damage was GONE, which included bone fragments, crushed nerve canal, paralysis. But I guess that's not good enough.

How about Stage 4 cancer involving all internal organs south of the heart? GONE within a week of discovery, and the hemorrhaging with it.

Funny, unbeliever neurologists and oncologists BELIEVED, but you a man of the faith, DON'T. There's something wrong with that picture. Peace

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 06:09 PM
You apparently want to see a miracle, because you don't have faith.

I have seen many miracles in response to faith in God's word.

You are being dull for the greatest miracle in all the world is the new birth...it is a stupendous miracle, it comes by faith in God's word.

Does God say "I am the Lord who healeth thee"?

Why do you not believe Him then?

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 06:11 PM
Was your miracle internal? They always are and they are always fraudulent.

I will pay a large sum of money for proof of a restored limb that has been amputated through an accident.

Before and after photos only please.

Usual nonsense arguments...how many amputees did Christ restore?

Totton Linnet
October 2nd, 2015, 06:24 PM
Was your miracle internal? They always are and they are always fraudulent.

I will pay a large sum of money for proof of a restored limb that has been amputated through an accident.

Before and after photos only please.

So your faith is by sight, you will believe only if you see.

Our faith is in God's word.

Bless the Lord oh my soul and forget not all His benefits
Who forgiveth all thine iniquities
Who healeth all thy diseases
Who satisfieth thy soul with good things

Robert Pate
October 3rd, 2015, 07:22 AM
"A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and there shall be no sign given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah" Matthew 16:4

The sign of the prophet Jonah is the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

RBBI
October 3rd, 2015, 08:43 AM
"A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and there shall be no sign given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah" Matthew 16:4

The sign of the prophet Jonah is the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

There's a difference between seeking after a sign, and signs and wonders FOLLOWING them that believe. Peter said, Yeshua was approved among them by signs and wonders. Timothy said to study to show thyself approved. Peace

Right Divider
October 3rd, 2015, 08:45 AM
You guys don't even understand the new covenant.

Robert Pate
October 3rd, 2015, 01:01 PM
There's a difference between seeking after a sign, and signs and wonders FOLLOWING them that believe. Peter said, Yeshua was approved among them by signs and wonders. Timothy said to study to show thyself approved. Peace


Not only do you seek for signs, you lust after them.

RBBI
October 3rd, 2015, 07:24 PM
Ridiculous.....

meshak
October 3rd, 2015, 07:28 PM
Not only do you seek for signs, you lust after them.

Idle talk.

Totton Linnet
October 4th, 2015, 02:37 AM
Was your miracle internal? They always are and they are always fraudulent.

I will pay a large sum of money for proof of a restored limb that has been amputated through an accident.

Before and after photos only please.

Doubting Robert

"Unless I see...unless I thrust my hand into His side"

Thomas gets a bad press for when the women first testified that He was risen NONE of the disciples believed.

Many good Christians today will not believe that Jesus Christ is the same today as He was in bible days.

God's word is "do not be disbelieving but be believing..." reach out and touch and pray in Jesu's name, if you are sick call for the elders of the church to come and anoint you...do not be disbelieving but be believing"

Totton Linnet
October 4th, 2015, 02:39 AM
The Pharisees asked for a sign.....they had seen His miracles

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 07:59 AM
The Pharisees asked for a sign.....they had seen His miracles


"For we walk by faith, not by sight" 2 Corinthians 5:7.

Truster
October 4th, 2015, 08:46 AM
"And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place" Acts 2:1.

The word must have gotten out that God was going to reveal some great thing to the apostles that he had never revealed to them before. People came from all over that part of the world to see and to hear what this was, Acts 2:9-11.

What happened next was one of the most amazing events in human history. A sound from heaven as of a rushing wind that filled the house where they were sitting. Cloven tongues like fire sat upon each one of them and they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues, Acts 2:2-4.

Whatever God was going to reveal to the apostles must be very important for there to be such a demonstration of the Holy Spirit such as this.

"Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues THE WONDERFUL WORKS OF GOD" Acts 2:11. The wonderful works of God is the Gospel of Jesus Christ. It is the Gospel that justifies ungodly sinners, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

This message preached by Peter on the day of Pentecost literally turned Jerusalem upside down. Thousand heard and believed the Gospel and were saved, Acts 2:41, Acts 4:4. It was the Gospel message that gave birth to the New Testament church. "Faith came by hearing and hearing by the Gospel of Jesus Christ" Romans 10:17.

No one was predestinated to hear and believe this Gospel message. Some that heard the Gospel and believed it had participated in the crucifixon of Christ, Acts 2:36. Jerusalem was never the same after the day of Pentecost. The scripture says that the apostles went everywhere preaching the resurrection of Jesus Christ, Acts 4:2. They did not preach the death or the crucifixon of Christ, they preached the resurrection.

Pentecostals need to take note that nothing, absolutly nothing was said about the Pentecost experience of the sound of the rushing wind or the tongues experience. The apostles had a much greater message than that. The had the Gospel of Jesus Christ. They had the Gospel that is the power of God unto salvation, Romans 1:16. They had the Gospel that justifies the ungodly, Romans 4:5 and reconciles the world unto God, 2 Corinthians 5:19.

By your own admission you haven't read the Bible, but not knowing that people were gathered in Jerusalem for the day of pentecost is further proof of your complete ignorance.

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 09:14 AM
By your own admission you haven't read the Bible, but not knowing that people were gathered in Jerusalem for the day of pentecost is further proof of your complete ignorance.

Where did I say that I have not read the Bible?

Where did I say that I did not know that people gathered together in Jerusalem for Pentecost?

I think that you are full of hot air.

Totton Linnet
October 4th, 2015, 10:40 AM
"For we walk by faith, not by sight" 2 Corinthians 5:7.

No, no, don't kid yourself YOU walk by sight for you say "unless I SEE I will not believe"

We believe the word....."who healeth all thine diseases"

Interplanner
October 4th, 2015, 10:53 AM
No, no, don't kid yourself YOU walk by sight for you say "unless I SEE I will not believe"

We believe the word....."who healeth all thine diseases"



We have to be careful not to put "walk by faith not sight" in a category that avoids proof or indicators or evidence. There are tons of it in the NT (please see my past this morning on the sighting of the 500).

By the time this expression is used in 2 Corinthians it has to do with Judaism. Judaism still expects a theocratic messiah and is dangerously close to falling for impostor ones over in Israel. That is a kingdom which is seen--or desired to be seen. The Christian's Messiah, though he did manifest in history, is not resulting in a theocratic power on earth, but there is no less power to his kingdom, because the Gospel is a solid, compelling message which faith "sees". Paul appeals to all individuals in all level of life to obey God because Christ reigns and will be the person through whom this world is judged on the last day.

Right Divider
October 4th, 2015, 11:00 AM
No, no, don't kid yourself YOU walk by sight for you say "unless I SEE I will not believe"

We believe the word....."who healeth all thine diseases"
Totton, don't just take a random verse to try to "prove" your point.

Truster
October 4th, 2015, 11:30 AM
Where did I say that I have not read the Bible?

Where did I say that I did not know that people gathered together in Jerusalem for Pentecost?

I think that you are full of hot air.

You have stated that you have not read the entire Bible....care to say you have?

In answer to the second try reading the first three lines of your post.

In answer to the last....ad hominem yet again.

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 01:53 PM
No, no, don't kid yourself YOU walk by sight for you say "unless I SEE I will not believe"

We believe the word....."who healeth all thine diseases"


You have no proof that God is doing miracles today.

At the blink of an eye, Jesus can restore blind eyes and severed limbs.

But he is not doing that today.

RBBI
October 4th, 2015, 02:09 PM
I am living proof that He is doing miracles today. Fortunately for me, your evil heart of unbelief was not around to deny the Word of HaShem, or I would have been dead decades ago.

As for eyes; I have another miracle for you. How do you explain needing reading glasses for 12 years, then suddenly your eyes (at age 59) are not only 20/20 again, but BETTER THAN THAT? I know my eye doctor had no explanation for it, but I do. Peace

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 02:14 PM
I am living proof that He is doing miracles today. Fortunately for me, your evil heart of unbelief was not around to deny the Word of HaShem, or I would have been dead decades ago.

As for eyes; I have another miracle for you. How do you explain needing reading glasses for 12 years, then suddenly your eyes (at age 59) are not only 20/20 again, but BETTER THAN THAT? I know my eye doctor had no explanation for it, but I do. Peace


How about the 10's of thousands of committed Christians that are suffering from cancer and a host of other diseases. Where is their miracle? I guess that you must be one of God's special ones or so you say.

aikido7
October 4th, 2015, 02:15 PM
I believe the church began to be in the wake of Jesus's crucifixion his followers huddled in sorrow, for the Jewish concept of "Messiah" was of an anointed military king who was to fight the powers and principalities of the world and ensure the ultimate freedom of the Nation of Israel.

If it were not for the fact of the resurrection, most ordinary Jews would not have joined the little band of Jesus's followers.

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 06:05 PM
I believe the church began to be in the wake of Jesus's crucifixion his followers huddled in sorrow, for the Jewish concept of "Messiah" was of an anointed military king who was to fight the powers and principalities of the world and ensure the ultimate freedom of the Nation of Israel.

If it were not for the fact of the resurrection, most ordinary Jews would not have joined the little band of Jesus's followers.

The apostles became powerful preachers of the Gospel after they found out what it was all about on the day of Pentecost, Acts 4:18-20.

aikido7
October 4th, 2015, 06:07 PM
The apostles became powerful preachers of the Gospel after they found out what it was all about on the day of Pentecost, Acts 4:18-20.Pentecost in Acts tells me the Jesus people were getting a real sense of their group and how it fit in with the state of Israel at the time.

Acts has a lot of information about the structure and leadership roles in the early movement.

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 06:13 PM
Pentecost in Acts tells me the Jesus people were getting a real sense of their group and how it fit in with the state of Israel at the time.

Acts has a lot of information about the structure and leadership roles in the early movement.

Israel was controled by Rome.

Christianity caused many problems for Rome. No sooner had they crucified Jesus and then this huge problem of all of his followers.

aikido7
October 4th, 2015, 06:19 PM
Israel was controled by Rome.

Christianity caused many problems for Rome. No sooner had they crucified Jesus and then this huge problem of all of his followers.
You're right. I too have been amazed at the anti-imperial theology of Paul's and, to a certain extent, in Luke.

After all, it was the powers and principalities of the world that killed Jesus. It was the case of the Domination System having the last word. But the resurrection meant that the last word belongs to God.

Robert Pate
October 4th, 2015, 06:24 PM
You're right. I too have been amazed at the anti-imperial theology of Paul's and, to a certain extent, in Luke.

After all, it was the powers and principalities of the world that killed Jesus. It was the case of the Domination System having the last word. But the resurrection meant that the last word belongs to God.

When Jesus walked out of Josephs new tomb that was the end of all world powers.

aikido7
October 4th, 2015, 06:34 PM
When Jesus walked out of Josephs new tomb that was the end of all world powers.I like to think it began to happen with his birth. The star, the astrologers, the shepherds, the acts of God for Mary and Joseph--all these were symptoms of a new world.

And the dreams of Pilate's wife...

RBBI
October 5th, 2015, 06:11 AM
When Jesus walked out of Josephs new tomb that was the end of all world powers.

:up:

Robert Pate
October 5th, 2015, 06:25 AM
Jesus is God's new creation and our new humanity, 2 Corinthians 5:17, also Colossians 1:20.

RBBI
October 5th, 2015, 06:35 AM
When Jesus walked out of Josephs new tomb that was the end of all world powers.

Don't you just love the living Word? Joseph means, "HaShem will add another". Yeshua walked out of that "tomb", and the next in line to be added was Benjamin, "son of my right hand".

And the one that sits at the right hand of the Father, is? :) Peace

aikido7
October 5th, 2015, 06:45 AM
When Jesus walked out of Josephs new tomb that was the end of all world powers.That is certainly theologically valid for most believers. But it is not the only proof Christians use for the meaning of the resurrection.

Robert Pate
October 5th, 2015, 02:33 PM
That is certainly theologically valid for most believers. But it is not the only proof Christians use for the meaning of the resurrection.

What the resurrection means is that, "Jesus is Lord", Philippians 2:9-11.

RBBI
October 6th, 2015, 01:02 AM
How about the 10's of thousands of committed Christians that are suffering from cancer and a host of other diseases. Where is their miracle? I guess that you must be one of God's special ones or so you say.

Not special, just blessed. What do you expect when 95% of the "churches" don't teach the whole Word? The Yeshua you perceive, is the one that returns to you. In churches where healing is preached and believed in, healings occur. In those where they don't, nothing happens. Faith without works is dead or death producing, and works without faith is dead, as well. Most of them are one or the other. It was said when He came to them in the boat walking on the water, that if they hadn't SEEN HIM, He would have passed them by. We have to perceive HIM correctly. He IS a healer, period.

There are people out there you hear about every once in awhile, who are prosecuted for not taking their kid to the doctor and the kid died. Sadly, they believed they were standing on the "word". They were standing on the letter, but without a proceeding word of life from the Father's mouth by which we LIVE, it is dead.

Man shall not live by bread/letter alone, but by every word (His Spirit breathed personal word) that proceeds from the mouth of HaShem. I got my Spirit breathed personal word, and stood on it. That was faith. When I called my mind a liar and commanded my body to line up with the WORD of HaShem (the Spirit breathed one), heaven (Spirit breathed word) and earth (me) came into agreement (works). Faith WITH works = the hand of HaShem moving. Peace

Robert Pate
October 6th, 2015, 07:55 AM
Not special, just blessed. What do you expect when 95% of the "churches" don't teach the whole Word? The Yeshua you perceive, is the one that returns to you. In churches where healing is preached and believed in, healings occur. In those where they don't, nothing happens. Faith without works is dead or death producing, and works without faith is dead, as well. Most of them are one or the other. It was said when He came to them in the boat walking on the water, that if they hadn't SEEN HIM, He would have passed them by. We have to perceive HIM correctly. He IS a healer, period.

There are people out there you hear about every once in awhile, who are prosecuted for not taking their kid to the doctor and the kid died. Sadly, they believed they were standing on the "word". They were standing on the letter, but without a proceeding word of life from the Father's mouth by which we LIVE, it is dead.

Man shall not live by bread/letter alone, but by every word (His Spirit breathed personal word) that proceeds from the mouth of HaShem. I got my Spirit breathed personal word, and stood on it. That was faith. When I called my mind a liar and commanded my body to line up with the WORD of HaShem (the Spirit breathed one), heaven (Spirit breathed word) and earth (me) came into agreement (works). Faith WITH works = the hand of HaShem moving. Peace



The reason that God is not performing miracles today is because he does not want to take away from the greatest miracle of all miracles, the incarnation of Jesus Christ and his Gospel.

This is the age of grace and faith. If you have to have a miracle you are probably not a believer in the saving power of Christ, which is the Gospel.

God is no respector of persons. If God was healing today, which he is not, then the whole Christian community would be healed, which they are not.

You need to get honest with yourself.

RBBI
October 6th, 2015, 01:50 PM
The reason that God is not performing miracles today is because he does not want to take away from the greatest miracle of all miracles, the incarnation of Jesus Christ and his Gospel.

This is the age of grace and faith. If you have to have a miracle you are probably not a believer in the saving power of Christ, which is the Gospel.

God is no respector of persons. If God was healing today, which he is not, then the whole Christian community would be healed, which they are not.

You need to get honest with yourself.

As many as believe Him, ARE. You said, He is no respecter of persons. Which means, there was not one covenant for early church and another one for the latter church (today). You need to understand covenant principles. A blood covenant is binding, and it does not change. Peace

Robert Pate
October 6th, 2015, 07:32 PM
As many as believe Him, ARE. You said, He is no respecter of persons. Which means, there was not one covenant for early church and another one for the latter church (today). You need to understand covenant principles. A blood covenant is binding, and it does not change. Peace

There is no covenant for the early church, nor is there a covenant for todays church.

Jesus is the new Covenant. There are no binding covenants. "The Just Shall Live By faith", not by laws rules or covenants.

Right Divider
October 6th, 2015, 08:38 PM
There is no covenant for the early church, nor is there a covenant for todays church.

Jesus is the new Covenant. There are no binding covenants. "The Just Shall Live By faith", no by laws rules or covenants.
Robert, you have some very crazy and unbiblical ideas.

Robert Pate
October 6th, 2015, 08:44 PM
Robert, you have some very crazy and unbiblical ideas.

You want to be under the law? Galatians 4:21.

Right Divider
October 6th, 2015, 08:55 PM
You want to be under the law? Galatians 4:21.
Completely unrelated to my post. This shows what a difficult time you have with simple things. Jesus is NOT the new covenant. Nowhere in the Bible can you find such a fanciful idea.

RBBI
October 6th, 2015, 09:38 PM
What he said.....Peace

Interplanner
October 7th, 2015, 08:31 AM
Completely unrelated to my post. This shows what a difficult time you have with simple things. Jesus is NOT the new covenant. Nowhere in the Bible can you find such a fanciful idea.



That's from an Isaiah passage, "I will make you a covenant for the people." When you realize what the new covenant is, and that is it is essentially the work of God in Christ (2 Cor 3-5), and that he said 'this is the covenant in my blood' (referring to his sacrifice), then it is not difficult to say that he was the covenant.

RBBI
October 7th, 2015, 10:18 AM
The covenant is Him writing the law in our hearts, and making us His sons. The blood and Yeshua have to do with HOW He does it. Peace

Right Divider
October 7th, 2015, 11:33 AM
That's from an Isaiah passage, "I will make you a covenant for the people." When you realize what the new covenant is, and that is it is essentially the work of God in Christ (2 Cor 3-5), and that he said 'this is the covenant in my blood' (referring to his sacrifice), then it is not difficult to say that he was the covenant.
That is a very fanciful stretching of a vivid imagination.

The Bible is very clear that the new covenant is a replacement for the old covenant. That is actually why the word NEW is in it. It is also clear that the new covenant is made between the same two parties, God and Israel.

Robert Pate
October 7th, 2015, 02:02 PM
That is a very fanciful stretching of a vivid imagination.

The Bible is very clear that the new covenant is a replacement for the old covenant. That is actually why the word NEW is in it. It is also clear that the new covenant is made between the same two parties, God and Israel.

Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of all laws, covenants, testaments.

Jesus is the mediator of the new covenant, simply because he is the intercessor of the new covenant, Hebrews 12:24.

All of the promises that God made to Israel have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ.

Right Divider
October 8th, 2015, 10:18 AM
Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of all laws, covenants, testaments.

Jesus is the mediator of the new covenant, simply because he is the intercessor of the new covenant, Hebrews 12:24.

All of the promises that God made to Israel have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ.
Total nonsense Robert.

Read ALL of Hebrews (and believe what is says):
Hebrews 8:8-11 KJV
8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
The new covenant is between the SAME TWO parties as the old covenant: God and Israel. This is just as God has said all along (as Hebrews 8 is quoting Jeremiah 31).

Robert Pate
October 9th, 2015, 09:10 AM
Total nonsense Robert.

Read ALL of Hebrews (and believe what is says):
Hebrews 8:8-11 KJV
8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah: 9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord. 10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people: 11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.
The new covenant is between the SAME TWO parties as the old covenant: God and Israel. This is just as God has said all along (as Hebrews 8 is quoting Jeremiah 31).


The new Covenant is Jesus Christ himself.

When Jesus died on the cross the curtain that covered the "Holy of Holies" was torn by God from the top to the bottom, Matthew 27:51. The temple was destroyed.

This signified the end of the Old Testament law, covenants and the Jewish religion. This is why Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. Not by rules, laws, covenants and religion.

Right Divider
October 9th, 2015, 09:38 AM
The new Covenant is Jesus Christ himself.

When Jesus died on the cross the curtain that covered the "Holy of Holies" was torn by God from the top to the bottom, Matthew 27:51. The temple was destroyed.

This signified the end of the Old Testament law, covenants and the Jewish religion. This is why Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. Not by rules, laws, covenants and religion.
Paul is quoting old covenant writing, not saying something new:
Hab 2:4 KJV Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.You have a lot to learn.

Robert Pate
October 9th, 2015, 01:48 PM
Paul is quoting old covenant writing, not saying something new:
Hab 2:4 KJV Behold, his soul which is lifted up is not upright in him: but the just shall live by his faith.You have a lot to learn.


There is no difference, whether it be New Testament or Old Testament "The Just Shall Live By Faith".

Right Divider
October 9th, 2015, 04:32 PM
There is no difference, whether it be New Testament or Old Testament "The Just Shall Live By Faith".
They why did YOU say "This is why Paul said...."?

The new Covenant is Jesus Christ himself.

When Jesus died on the cross the curtain that covered the "Holy of Holies" was torn by God from the top to the bottom, Matthew 27:51. The temple was destroyed.

This signified the end of the Old Testament law, covenants and the Jewish religion. This is why Paul wrote, "The just shall live by faith" Romans 1:17. Not by rules, laws, covenants and religion.

You just cannot come to grips with the truth of scripture. Your understanding of the old and new covenants needs tons of work.

Jesus is not the new covenant, no matter how much you try to make it so.

When Jesus returns to establish His kingdom and brings in the new covenant, He will "put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts"(Jer 31:33). Do you think that they just ignore the law at that point?

Robert Pate
October 10th, 2015, 04:04 PM
They why did YOU say "This is why Paul said...."?


You just cannot come to grips with the truth of scripture. Your understanding of the old and new covenants needs tons of work.

Jesus is not the new covenant, no matter how much you try to make it so.

When Jesus returns to establish His kingdom and brings in the new covenant, He will "put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts"(Jer 31:33). Do you think that they just ignore the law at that point?

There will be no laws, rules or covenants for the Christian when Jesus returns.

Where there is laws and rules there is judgment.

We will be like him when he appears, Colossians 3:4.

achduke
October 10th, 2015, 05:45 PM
There will be no laws, rules or covenants for the Christian when Jesus returns.

Where there is laws and rules there is judgment.

We will be like him when he appears, Colossians 3:4.

There is always right and wrong. Laws dictate what is right. The holy spirit leads us to follow the law(instructions) and not to break it in the future.

jamie
October 10th, 2015, 06:53 PM
There is no covenant for the early church, nor is there a covenant for todays church.


Paul had a different opinion.


And this I say that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. (Galatians 3:17 NKJV)

It was Paul's opinion that the Mt. Sinai covenant did not annul the Abrahamic covenant which is why Paul said, "And if you are Christís, then you are Abrahamís seed and heirs according to the promise. (Galatians 3:29 NKJV)

Robert Pate
October 10th, 2015, 08:31 PM
There is always right and wrong. Laws dictate what is right. The holy spirit leads us to follow the law(instructions) and not to break it in the future.

There will be no laws in heaven because there will be no sin in heaven.

A good Son does not need to be told what to do. He knows what pleases his Father and what does not please his Father.

Paul said that the law is for sinners and the disobedient, 1 Timothy 1:9, 10.

Robert Pate
October 10th, 2015, 08:38 PM
Paul had a different opinion.


And this I say that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. (Galatians 3:17 NKJV)

It was Paul's opinion that the Mt. Sinai covenant did not annul the Abrahamic covenant which is why Paul said, "And if you are Christís, then you are Abrahamís seed and heirs according to the promise. (Galatians 3:29 NKJV)


All of the promises that God made to Israel have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ. Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law and the old covenant.

Paul said to be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.

jamie
October 10th, 2015, 11:13 PM
All of the promises that God made to Israel have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ. Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law and the old covenant.

Paul said to be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10.


If what you say is true then why do you keep talking about the law?

achduke
October 11th, 2015, 06:00 AM
There will be no laws in heaven because there will be no sin in heaven.

A good Son does not need to be told what to do. He knows what pleases his Father and what does not please his Father.

Paul said that the law is for sinners and the disobedient, 1 Timothy 1:9, 10.

The law is for sinners but it still exists.

Ezekiel 36:27 I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgments and do them.

Robert Pate
October 11th, 2015, 06:37 AM
If what you say is true then why do you keep talking about the law?

Because you think that you have to do it.

Robert Pate
October 11th, 2015, 06:39 AM
The law is for sinners but it still exists.

Ezekiel 36:27 I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgments and do them.

That's Old Testament stuff that was written under the law.

Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law.

RBBI
October 11th, 2015, 06:39 AM
The Spirit came so we COULD keep the law, which is why Yeshua, speaking as the Seed, said He came not to do away with the law. Peace

Robert Pate
October 11th, 2015, 06:51 AM
The Spirit came so we COULD keep the law, which is why Yeshua, speaking as the Seed, said He came not to do away with the law. Peace

I am afraid not.

The Spirit replaces the law, but it is not another law.

To live by the Spirit is to live by faith in Christ and his Gospel.

"The Just Shall Live By Faith" not by rules, laws or religion.

Paul said to be under the law is to be under a curse, Galatians 3:10, 11.

Under the law you have to do. Under grace you want to do. Big, big, difference.

achduke
October 11th, 2015, 06:52 AM
That's Old Testament stuff that was written under the law.

Jesus is the end and the fulfillment of the law.

Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I do not change; therefore you are not consumed, O sons of Jacob.

Matthew 5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.


Does God change? Has the heavens and earth passed away?

Robert Pate
October 11th, 2015, 06:57 AM
Malachi 3:6 For I am the LORD, I do not change; therefore you are not consumed, O sons of Jacob.

Matthew 5:18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.


Does God change? Has the heavens and earth passed away?

All of the law was fulfilled in Jesus Christ and then it was abolished, for the Christian. But it still applies for the unbeliever.

If you think that you have to do the law to be saved, you are not saved.

achduke
October 11th, 2015, 07:11 AM
All of the law was fulfilled in Jesus Christ and then it was abolished, for the Christian. But it still applies for the unbeliever.

If you think that you have to do the law to be saved, you are not saved.

Christ says he did not come to abolish the law yet you say he did.

We are not saved by keeping the law. Still If you think by breaking the law you are saved then that is incorrect.

jamie
October 11th, 2015, 08:28 AM
Because you think that you have to do it.


Why does that concern you? Paul didn't speak against the Law of the Jews but yet you do. Why?

Right Divider
October 11th, 2015, 09:08 AM
There will be no laws, rules or covenants for the Christian when Jesus returns.

Where there is laws and rules there is judgment.

We will be like him when he appears, Colossians 3:4.
Continuing in your ignorance..... the body of Christ is NOT Israel and Israel is NOT the body of Christ.

I've noticed how you have conveniently ignored the prophecy from Jeremiah.

Get with Gods programs in ALL of the Bible Robert.

OCTOBER23
October 11th, 2015, 09:12 AM
The Apostles were AFRAID OF THE JEWISH AUTHORITIES AND PRIESTS.

It was ust like the Catholic Inquisition days.

Robert Pate
October 11th, 2015, 09:31 AM
The Apostles were AFRAID OF THE JEWISH AUTHORITIES AND PRIESTS.

It was ust like the Catholic Inquisition days.

According to Fox's Book of Martyrs, all of the apostles died violent deaths except for John. He fled to the island of Patmos.