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intojoy
April 28th, 2014, 03:36 PM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehe

intojoy
January 23rd, 2015, 01:44 AM
TOL's idiot lost:
M.....
C..
G.

MaxGrit
January 23rd, 2015, 01:50 AM
How can OSAS if clearly we have God hating atheist ex-Christians who claim to have been saved and then get angry at God and start hating God?

Grosnick Marowbe
January 23rd, 2015, 02:00 AM
TOL's idiot lost:
M.....
C..
G.

What are the identities of these 3?

heir
January 23rd, 2015, 06:06 AM
How can OSAS if clearly we have God hating atheist ex-Christians who claim to have been saved and then get angry at God and start hating God?

Were they ever saved and if they were what makes you think they lost it?

chrysostom
January 23rd, 2015, 06:11 AM
Were they ever saved and if they were what makes you think they lost it?

what makes you think they are saved?

TulipBee
January 23rd, 2015, 06:11 AM
Cant be me.
elects are always elects.
Believers can't unbelief.

heir
January 23rd, 2015, 06:12 AM
what makes you think they are saved?Who?

chrysostom
January 23rd, 2015, 06:13 AM
Who?

anyone

heir
January 23rd, 2015, 06:15 AM
anyone

Paul writes that those of us who have trusted the Lord for salvation believing the gospel of Christ are saved 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV.

heir
January 23rd, 2015, 06:16 AM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehegodrulz

chrysostom
January 23rd, 2015, 06:21 AM
Paul writes that those of us who have trusted the Lord for salvation believing the gospel of Christ are saved 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV.

what about the 'if'

By which also ye are dsaved, if ye ||keep in memory †what I preached unto you,

Nick M
January 23rd, 2015, 07:11 AM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?



No kidding. We do not draw division among the brethren.

Nick M
January 23rd, 2015, 07:12 AM
what about the 'if'

By which also ye are dsaved, if ye ||keep in memory †what I preached unto you,

That is right. Do not discard the gospel like you do.

chrysostom
January 23rd, 2015, 07:21 AM
what about the 'might be saved'? (https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?search=%22might+be+saved%22&version=KJV&searchtype=all&wholewordsonly=yes)

Nick M
January 23rd, 2015, 07:23 AM
what about the 'might be saved'? (https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?search=%22might+be+saved%22&version=KJV&searchtype=all&wholewordsonly=yes)

We have told you many times that you have to accept the free gift. If somebody tells you here is a million dollars in this briefcase, it is a gift to you, and you walk away from it, you don't have a million dollars.

Nimrod
January 23rd, 2015, 07:57 AM
We have told you many times that you have to accept the free gift.

That is works salvation. Very similar to Rome.

Bible states clearly. All are unrighteous, all are incapable to do good.
To "accept free gift" is asking someone to do good. But the Scriptures says that is impossible.

Nick M
January 23rd, 2015, 08:04 AM
That is works salvation.

Congratulations on your idiot post of the day. There is nothing to refute. You just said if somebody does no works, but instead accepts a gift that is works.

Fascinating.....:nono:

serpentdove
January 23rd, 2015, 08:31 AM
...[Y]ou many times that you have to accept the free gift. If somebody tells you here is a million dollars in this briefcase, it is a gift to you, and you walk away from it, you don't have a million dollars.


That is works salvation. Very similar to Rome.

Bible states clearly. All are unrighteous, all are incapable to do good. To "accept free gift" is asking someone to do good. But the Scriptures says that is impossible.

No one seeks God (Ro 3:11). God seeks men so when they are found as it were, it's his grace not their goodness (Ac 17:27).

Men are commanded to repent (Ac 2:38).

Ha Nazir
January 23rd, 2015, 08:51 AM
Nobody is saved by their own efforts, church doctrines or anything they believe.

Only God can "save" a soul. If God "saves" a soul, it can't be "lost". To say otherwise is foolish.

The key to understanding this is to realize what it is that is being "saved".

musterion
January 23rd, 2015, 08:56 AM
That is works salvation. Very similar to Rome.

Bible states clearly. All are unrighteous, all are incapable to do good.
To "accept free gift" is asking someone to do good. But the Scriptures says that is impossible.

You just condemned Paul.

Nimrod
January 23rd, 2015, 11:09 AM
Congratulations on your idiot post of the day. There is nothing to refute. You just said if somebody does no works, but instead accepts a gift that is works.

Fascinating.....:nono:

To "accept" is an action by man. It is what the Bible refers to as "works".

heir
January 23rd, 2015, 11:36 AM
what about the 'if'

By which also ye are dsaved, if ye ||keep in memory †what I preached unto you,
I trusted the Lord believing all of the elements of the gospel of Christ; that Christ died for our sins, that He was buried and that He rose again the third day. Those who don't believe all of those, such as the resurrection are those who "believed in vain".

1 Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

1 Corinthians 15:2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

1 Corinthians 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

1 Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

...

1 Corinthians 15:12 Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?

1 Corinthians 15:13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:

1 Corinthians 15:14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.

1 Corinthians 15:15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.

1 Corinthians 15:16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:

1 Corinthians 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

republicanchick
January 23rd, 2015, 01:20 PM
Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehe

how utterly and deplorably ABSURD

you will never get grace in your soul if you don't DO good things. And again, if humans do not do good deeds, they do evil ones... b/c it is evil to NOT do certain things: feed the hungry (Mt 25:31), comfort the afflicted/oppressed/lonely... etc..

you osasers need to read the Bible

Mt 25:31 says that those who do not feed the hungry, comfort the lonely, etc... "will go off to ETERNAL punishment" [emphasis added]


then there is Mt 18:23 (Purgatory... punishment that eventually ends...)

and a whole lot of others..



+++

republicanchick
January 23rd, 2015, 01:23 PM
Y did I mention Mt 18:23 which has to do with temporary punishment aka Purgatory?

I meant to quote only scriptures about Hell, which is where people who disobey Christ go, whether they have "accepted Christ" or not..

"Even the demons believe and tremble" (James 2:14)



++

republicanchick
January 23rd, 2015, 01:24 PM
I 1 Corinthians 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.

I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

makes no sense. We all know the Bible to one extent or another.. It is people's (faulty) interpretations that need attn.


+

republicanchick
January 23rd, 2015, 01:25 PM
How can OSAS if clearly we have God hating atheist ex-Christians who claim to have been saved and then get angry at God and start hating God?

??????????????


?????


:nono:

musterion
January 23rd, 2015, 02:17 PM
To "accept" is an action by man. It is what the Bible refers to as "works".

Liar. To "accept Christ" is to believe the Gospel. That's faith: not only the opposite of works but excludes works.

republicanchick
January 23rd, 2015, 02:28 PM
We have told you many times that you have to accept the free gift. If somebody tells you here is a million dollars in this briefcase, it is a gift to you, and you walk away from it, you don't have a million dollars.

and Jesus said to feed the hungry and care for the lonely, etc...

if you walk away from that, you don't have salvation



+

Right Divider
January 23rd, 2015, 02:59 PM
I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

Oh really?

"Even the demons believe and tremble" (James 2:14 (http://biblia.com/bible/nkjv/James%202.14))

And you quote this as IF it's James 2:14, which is ACTUALLY:

Jas 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

The devils have not put their faith in Christ. They simply believe THAT THERE IS ONE GOD.

You are a deceiver.

Nimrod
January 23rd, 2015, 05:02 PM
Liar. To "accept Christ" is to believe the Gospel. That's faith: not only the opposite of works but excludes works.

To Believe the gospel, is that considered good?

Romans 3:12 "They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that do good, no, not one."

Faith is something given from God. It does not come from within. One can not have faith by themselves. God has to put that part in you. A Roman Catholic can believe all day Jesus is God, but he has no faith. Faith comes to those who as "born-again". I bet you are not "born-again".

musterion
January 23rd, 2015, 05:11 PM
To Believe the gospel, is that considered good?

Of course it is. It pleases God. But it's not work; it's the opposite of work. Work is done by people who believe they have something to give God, or that God requires them to do something "or else." That contradicts the Gospel of grace because, today, all He asks is faith in what His Son has done for us all.

Do you deny that?


Romans 3:12 "They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that do good, no, not one."Mind the context. That's talking about unsaved people of all human history.


Faith is something given from God.If that's true, then God gives it to everyone without exception. Everyone gets enough faith to do what He wants. That's the ONLY way He can justly damn those who will not believe.


One can not have faith by themselves.Then if saving faith comes only from God, He is unjust and corrupt for expecting it from those He knows He did not give it to.


I bet you are not "born-again".I couldn't care less what you bet.

Tell me, what is the Gospel by which we're to be saved? Be specific, leave nothing out.

Totton Linnet
January 23rd, 2015, 05:33 PM
what about the 'if'

By which also ye are dsaved, if ye ||keep in memory †what I preached unto you,

OSAS ites are the ones who DO keep in mind what Paul said, we remember he said salvation is a free gift.

Those that oppose OSAS forget it's a free gift and think it must be earned.

Totton Linnet
January 23rd, 2015, 05:36 PM
I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

makes no sense. We all know the Bible to one extent or another.. It is people's (faulty) interpretations that need attn.


+

We BELIEVE what the bible says...we don't believe what you say.

Right Divider
January 23rd, 2015, 06:08 PM
To Believe the gospel, is that considered good?

Romans 3:12 "They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that do good, no, not one."

Faith is something given from God. It does not come from within. One can not have faith by themselves. God has to put that part in you. A Roman Catholic can believe all day Jesus is God, but he has no faith. Faith comes to those who as "born-again". I bet you are not "born-again".
Paul makes it crystal clear that believing is NOT a work.
Rom 4:4-5 KJV Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. (5) But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Paul CONTRASTS work and belief. It's ONE or the OTHER.

glorydaz
January 23rd, 2015, 06:28 PM
Paul makes it crystal clear that believing is NOT a work.
Rom 4:4-5 KJV Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. (5) But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Paul CONTRASTS work and belief. It's ONE or the OTHER.

Why is it that not one of them will admit what is so clearly written in that verse? :idunno:

glorydaz
January 23rd, 2015, 06:31 PM
OSAS ites are the ones who DO keep in mind what Paul said, we remember he said salvation is a free gift.

Those that oppose OSAS forget it's a free gift and think it must be earned.

Every humanist from every religion insists they can earn eternal life themselves. It's simply unbelief on their part. They aren't persuaded that God is able to do what they can't do for themselves. Sad.

glorydaz
January 23rd, 2015, 06:35 PM
To Believe the gospel, is that considered good?

Romans 3:12 "They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that do good, no, not one."

Faith is something given from God. It does not come from within. One can not have faith by themselves. God has to put that part in you. A Roman Catholic can believe all day Jesus is God, but he has no faith. Faith comes to those who as "born-again". I bet you are not "born-again".

So, God believes in Himself for us? And He trusts Himself for us, as well? You need to rethink what you're claiming here. Perhaps you don't really understand what faith is....

Nimrod
January 23rd, 2015, 10:00 PM
Mind the context. That's talking about unsaved people of all human history.


If Romans 3:12 is talking about unsaved people. How then do unsaved people do good? For you said, it was good to believe.

Nimrod
January 23rd, 2015, 10:06 PM
The devils have not put their faith in Christ. They simply believe THAT THERE IS ONE GOD.


If a devil or demon do put their faith in Christ, will they get saved?

Nick M
January 23rd, 2015, 10:10 PM
Why is it that not one of them will admit what is so clearly written in that verse? :idunno:

Because they know what it says and are going to try and pull people form the faith.


I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

makes no sense. We all know the Bible to one extent or another.. It is people's (faulty) interpretations that need attn.

dreadknought
January 23rd, 2015, 10:19 PM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. HeheAsking others to judge? Those outside of the body are judged already.

intojoy
January 24th, 2015, 03:16 AM
What are the identities of these 3?

Meshak Bs Guy and GT

Lazy afternoon
January 24th, 2015, 04:09 AM
Liar. To "accept Christ" is to believe the Gospel. That's faith: not only the opposite of works but excludes works.

Believing the gospel is only part way to being saved.

There are works of faith.

Jesus called them fruit.


Joh 15:1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
Joh 15:2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
Joh 15:3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
Joh 15:4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
Joh 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
Joh 15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Paul said---

Act 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
Act 26:20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
Act 26:21 For these causes the Jews caught me in the temple, and went about to kill me.

LA

chrysostom
January 24th, 2015, 07:00 AM
OSAS ites are the ones who DO keep in mind what Paul said, we remember he said salvation is a free gift.

Those that oppose OSAS forget it's a free gift and think it must be earned.

redemption is a free gift
but
not salvation

the phrase once saved always saved
suggests you are not really saved
or
you do not understand what saved means

saved is saved

meshak
January 24th, 2015, 08:12 AM
redemption is a free gift


Protestants use this vague expression of Paul's word to pervert Christianity.

Jesus did not teach it.

Jesus emphasized over and over to be faithful or obedient to Him until the end.

Christianity is all about obeying Jesus' teachings and commands.

chrysostom
January 24th, 2015, 08:15 AM
Protestants use this vague expression of Paul's word to pervert Christianity.

Jesus did not teach it.

Jesus emphasized over and over to be faithful or obedient to Him until the end.

Christianity is all about obeying Jesus' teachings and commands.

so what is the good news?

meshak
January 24th, 2015, 08:22 AM
so what is the good news?

God's kingdom.

It is available to anyone who love God and Jesus with their words and deeds.

I order to do that, we have to give up our worldly desires and mentality.

Jesus teaches us how to do that in His word.

chrysostom
January 24th, 2015, 08:26 AM
God's kingdom.

It is available to anyone who love God and Jesus with their words and deeds.

I order to do that, we have to give up our worldly desires and mentality.

Jesus teaches us how to do that in His word.

great answer

heir
January 24th, 2015, 09:00 AM
redemption is a free gift
but
not salvationEphesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Ephesians 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.


Romans 11:6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then it is no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.

Your mind is corrupted.

Zeke
January 24th, 2015, 10:02 AM
Of course it is. It pleases God. But it's not work; it's the opposite of work. Work is done by people who believe they have something to give God, or that God requires them to do something "or else." That contradicts the Gospel of grace because, today, all He asks is faith in what His Son has done for us all.

Do you deny that?

Mind the context. That's talking about unsaved people of all human history.

If that's true, then God gives it to everyone without exception. Everyone gets enough faith to do what He wants. That's the ONLY way He can justly damn those who will not believe.

Then if saving faith comes only from God, He is unjust and corrupt for expecting it from those He knows He did not give it to.

I couldn't care less what you bet.

Tell me, what is the Gospel by which we're to be saved? Be specific, leave nothing out.

Romans 9:21, 11:16, 11:28, 11:30, 11:32, 11:33-34, universal lump is leavened or every so called sin wasn't paid for by Christ, though this is an inward principle the outward story results in the same way, all are saved or none of the fruit is excepted at the end of the tale.

CherubRam
January 24th, 2015, 10:14 AM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehe

Grace is not a license to sin.

Hebrews 10:26
If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,...

intojoy
January 24th, 2015, 12:10 PM
so what is the good news?

Eternal life is the free gift of God.
Redemption is not free as Messiah paid for it.
Obedience to God is that we believe the Father is well pleased with the Son, God is indeed well pleased with the redemption purchased by Messiah and we who believe are united to God thru the Messiah. Those who reject the peace of God made thru redemption (that was not free) will be punished for their sins. I can never be punished for my sins, God punished Messiah in my place and set me free from guilt and condemnation.

intojoy
January 24th, 2015, 12:11 PM
Grace is not a license to sin.

Hebrews 10:26
If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left,...

Where sin abounds grace abounds more. But we are not to take this fact and use it as a liscence to sin.

john w
January 24th, 2015, 03:24 PM
and Jesus said to feed the hungry and care for the lonely, etc...

if you walk away from that, you don't have salvation



+

This "Jesus" you reference also said to sell all you have.


Do it.

heir
January 24th, 2015, 03:33 PM
and Jesus said to feed the hungry and care for the lonely, etc...

if you walk away from that, you don't have salvation



+:rolleyes: Someone should have told God that Christ did not have to die on the cross for our sins, be buried and be raised from the dead for our justification; we could have just had a potluck dinner. And forget that rightly dividing stuff too, we'll just make it all one pot meal as to us for our obedience which can't be done.

Nimrod
January 24th, 2015, 04:24 PM
To Believe the gospel, is that considered good?

Of course it is. It pleases God.


Romans 3:12 "They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that do good, no, not one."

Mind the context. That's talking about unsaved people of all human history.


How does unsaved people believe the gospel if they are unable to do good?

musterion
January 24th, 2015, 04:29 PM
How does unsaved people believe the gospel if they are unable to do good?

They're able to believe the Gospel. Most don't.

Look at Cain. Born dead in his father's sin. Yet God tried to reason with him before he slew his brother.

Why was God attempting to appeal to someone who could do no good? Is God a liar?

Nimrod
January 24th, 2015, 06:04 PM
They're able to believe the Gospel. Most don't.

Scriptures say "none do good". Yet, you think unbelievers can do good.
This is why synergists are not consistent. They have to twist what was said.

I'm on Scriptures side. "none do good". You can only do good when God enables you to do so. To have faith is only possible if God gives it to you.

glorydaz
January 24th, 2015, 06:47 PM
Scriptures say "none do good". Yet, you think unbelievers can do good.
This is why synergists are not consistent. They have to twist what was said.

I'm on Scriptures side. "none do good". You can only do good when God enables you to do so. To have faith is only possible if God gives it to you.

Doing good and hearing are two different things. Your claim that faith is given to us by God is contrary to the Gospel being the POWER of God unto salvation. Faith comes from hearing and hearing BY THE WORD OF GOD.


Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

There would be NO POINT in preaching the Gospel if it didn't have the POWER to persuade men. Persuade is a very important word....

And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not HEARD?

And how shall they HEAR without a preacher? :think:


Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

intojoy
January 24th, 2015, 07:48 PM
Scriptures say "none do good". Yet, you think unbelievers can do good.
This is why synergists are not consistent. They have to twist what was said.

I'm on Scriptures side. "none do good". You can only do good when God enables you to do so. To have faith is only possible if God gives it to you.

Unbelievers can do good.
But not in a sense of earning God's favor. Yet God did recognize the actions of unbelievers in the scriptures as good.

TulipBee
January 24th, 2015, 08:03 PM
Scriptures say "none do good". Yet, you think unbelievers can do good.
This is why synergists are not consistent. They have to twist what was said.

I'm on Scriptures side. "none do good". You can only do good when God enables you to do so. To have faith is only possible if God gives it to you.

That's right. Don't listen to the Reprobates.

Let them play and pretend in Goodville.

Right Divider
January 25th, 2015, 01:24 PM
If a devil or demon do put their faith in Christ, will they get saved?
Attempted deflections always amuse me.

Nimrod
January 25th, 2015, 09:24 PM
Doing good and hearing are two different things.

I asked if "believing the gospel" is good. He said Yes.

I point to Scripture Romans 3:12 " None do good ". He said it refers to unbelievers.

So if unbelievers can not do good, how can they "believe the gospel"?

This is a problem with your theology. Synergism will have to twist what was clearly said. While you are unable to comprehend.

TulipBee
January 26th, 2015, 07:01 AM
I asked if "believing the gospel" is good. He said Yes.

I point to Scripture Romans 3:12 " None do good ". He said it refers to unbelievers.

So if unbelievers can not do good, how can they "believe the gospel"?

This is a problem with your theology. Synergism will have to twist what was clearly said. While you are unable to comprehend.

This is common sense to those God never drew or to those God drew.

It beats me that 90% of the TOL'ers don't have simple common sense .

Beats me why God created so many silly people.

http://kalihawlk.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/stoked-minions.gif

SaulToPaul
January 26th, 2015, 11:19 AM
Do it.

Do it, do it, for the love of Mike...

john w
January 26th, 2015, 03:51 PM
Do it, do it, for the love of Mike...

You shore are the wiry, moody, sensitive type. You need to go on over to the corner room, at "The Y," and relax, with perhaps some chilli.

God's Truth
April 2nd, 2015, 01:59 AM
Paul writes that those of us who have trusted the Lord for salvation believing the gospel of Christ are saved 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV.

According to you, they are saved for believing and not obeying, for you say if anyone believes and did anything, such as repent, then they are not saved.

God's Truth
April 2nd, 2015, 02:02 AM
If once saved always saved, then why does Jesus say a person who keeps sinning has NO PERMANENT place in the HOME?

John 8:35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

intojoy
April 2nd, 2015, 02:14 AM
If once saved always saved, then why does Jesus say a person who keeps sinning has NO PERMANENT place in the HOME?

John 8:35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.


Your judging shows you're guilt of the very same wicked deeds my son.

God's Truth
April 2nd, 2015, 02:26 AM
Your judging shows you're guilt of the very same wicked deeds my son.

My defense is God's Word.

All I have to do is speak God's Truth and you get riled up.

Keep listening and being offended.

glorydaz
April 3rd, 2015, 06:20 PM
I asked if "believing the gospel" is good. He said Yes.

I point to Scripture Romans 3:12 " None do good ". He said it refers to unbelievers.

So if unbelievers can not do good, how can they "believe the gospel"?

This is a problem with your theology. Synergism will have to twist what was clearly said. While you are unable to comprehend.

Whoever "he" is, he is correct. Of course you'd have to actually read the scripture Paul was quoting from before you'd notice that there are two groups of people. The fool who says there is no God and "my people".

How can they believe? Simple.....we believe without DOING one single thing. Believing is being persuaded (by facts in evidence) that some certain fact is true. When I look outside and see the rain, I believe it is raining. God makes the rain....it rains in spite of anything I might do. I see an apple fall from the tree and believe in gravity. Did I do one single thing to make that apple fall? You won't be able to "comprehend" anything unless you use the brain God gave you. ;)

If you read the scripture Paul cites, he most certainly is speaking of unbelievers. The fool has said in his heart there is no God. Are those men fools who believe?


Psalm 14:1-5
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good. The Lord looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God. They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one. Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the Lord. There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous.

glorydaz
April 3rd, 2015, 06:24 PM
If once saved always saved, then why does Jesus say a person who keeps sinning has NO PERMANENT place in the HOME?

John 8:35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

You workers are slaves. Those who believe are adopted into the family....just as John says, "a son abides forever". :duh:

The law was made for sinners such as you....until faith comes. Sadly, your faith is in your own obedience. Man can only be justified by the obedience of the ONE Lord Jesus Christ. Not you, and you should thank God salvation does not rest on your obedience.

Grosnick Marowbe
April 3rd, 2015, 06:30 PM
Doing good and hearing are two different things. Your claim that faith is given to us by God is contrary to the Gospel being the POWER of God unto salvation. Faith comes from hearing and hearing BY THE WORD OF GOD.


Romans 10:17
So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

There would be NO POINT in preaching the Gospel if it didn't have the POWER to persuade men. Persuade is a very important word....

And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not HEARD?

And how shall they HEAR without a preacher? :think:


Romans 10:14
How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?

AMEN! G

Grosnick Marowbe
April 3rd, 2015, 06:31 PM
You workers are slaves. Those who believe are adopted into the family....just as John says, "a son abides forever". :duh:

The law was made for sinners such as you....until faith comes. Sadly, your faith is in your own obedience. Man can only be justified by the obedience of the ONE Lord Jesus Christ. Not you, and you should thank God salvation does not rest on your obedience.

If it did, she'd be in REAL trouble!

glorydaz
April 3rd, 2015, 06:31 PM
According to you, they are saved for believing and not obeying, for you say if anyone believes and did anything, such as repent, then they are not saved.

You don't even know the meaning of the word "repent", so I'd suggest you zip your lip before you step on it. :chuckle:


It's such a simple truth, yet you can't quite figure it out. :nono:

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

glorydaz
April 3rd, 2015, 06:32 PM
If it did, she'd be in REAL trouble!

Indeed, and so would all the rest of us.

Hey, GM. :wave:

Grosnick Marowbe
April 3rd, 2015, 06:35 PM
This is common sense to those God never drew or to those God drew.

It beats me that 90% of the TOL'ers don't have simple common sense .

Beats me why God created so many silly people.

http://kalihawlk.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/stoked-minions.gif

It beats me, why they let "Nitwits" like yourself to spread their
false doctrine all over TOL?

Grosnick Marowbe
April 3rd, 2015, 06:35 PM
You don't even know the meaning of the word "repent", so I'd suggest you zip your lip before you step on it. :chuckle:


It's such a simple truth, yet you can't quite figure it out. :nono:

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Good post!

Grosnick Marowbe
April 3rd, 2015, 06:38 PM
If once saved always saved, then why does Jesus say a person who keeps sinning has NO PERMANENT place in the HOME?

John 8:35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

Christ was speaking to the Jews!

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 02:37 PM
You workers are slaves.
Oh yes I am. I am a slave to Christ. I am a slave to obedience. I am a slave to righteousness. I am a slave to God.


Romans 6:16 Don't you know that when you offer yourselves to someone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one you obey--whether you are slaves to sin, which leads to death, or to obedience, which leads to righteousness?

Romans 6:18; Romans 6:22; 1 Corinthians 7:22; 2 Timothy 2:24; Ephesians 6:6.




Those who believe are adopted into the family....just as John says, "a son abides forever". :duh:

Those who obey Jesus are sons.

Luke 8:21 But he replied to them, "My mother and my brothers are those who hear the word of God and do it."



The law was made for sinners such as you....until faith comes.
Faith does not destroy the Word of God. Faith does not destroy everything that God says.




Sadly, your faith is in your own obedience.
Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says.



Man can only be justified by the obedience of the ONE Lord Jesus Christ. Not you, and you should thank God salvation does not rest on your obedience.

Jesus' words are life. If anyone wants life, they have to eat. Eating is obeying. You do not just look at your food and believe it is good do you? Do you eat your food? You cannot eat Jesus unless you obey Jesus.

john w
April 4th, 2015, 02:57 PM
Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says



Which you don't do, despite your satanic denials, to the contrary.

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 03:10 PM
You don't even know the meaning of the word "repent",
I have already proven with scripture many times that repent is from sins that we do.

REPENT IS ABOUT SINS.

Acts 26:20 First to those in Damascus, then to those in Jerusalem and in all Judea, and to the Gentiles also, I preached that they should repent and turn to God and prove their repentance by their deeds.

Acts 2:38 Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

Acts 3:19 Therefore repent and turn back so that your sins may be wiped out,

Acts 17:30 Therefore, although God has overlooked such times of ignorance, he now commands all people everywhere to repent,

Acts 8:22 Therefore repent of this wickedness of yours, and pray to the Lord that he may perhaps forgive you for the intent of your heart.


Revelation 9:20 The rest of mankind who were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood--idols that cannot see or hear or walk.

21 Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts.

Revelation 16:9 They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.

Revelation 16:10 The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony

11 and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.



so I'd suggest you zip your lip before you step on it. :chuckle:
Step in what, false teachings?



It's such a simple truth, yet you can't quite figure it out. :nono:

Romans 4:3 For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.

Abraham believed in God and so much so----that he obeyed God.

Genesis 22:18 and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because you have obeyed me."

Genesis 18:19 For I have chosen him, so that he will direct his children and his household after him to keep the way of the LORD by doing what is right and just, so that the LORD will bring about for Abraham what he has promised him."

“By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.” Hebrews 11:8

You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? 21 Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did

Hebrews 11:8 By faith Abraham, when called to go to a place he would later receive as his inheritance, obeyed and went, even though he did not know where he was going.

Genesis 26:5 because Abraham obeyed me and did everything I required of him, keeping my commands, my decrees and my instructions."

James 2:21 Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar?

James 2:22 You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did.

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 03:11 PM
Which you don't do, despite your satanic denials, to the contrary.

You have to defend your false teachings by accusing me. I defend God's Truth with God's Truth.

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 03:12 PM
Christ was speaking to the Jews!

First to the Jews, then to everyone else.

Grosnick Marowbe
April 4th, 2015, 04:49 PM
First to the Jews, then to everyone else.

Christ said Himself in Matthew 15:24 "But he answered and said,
I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

You don't believe Him?

john w
April 4th, 2015, 05:38 PM
You have to defend your false teachings by accusing me. I defend God's Truth with God's Truth.

http://www.theologyonline.com/forums...=109122&page=4

Post #60

"I do not sin. I have stumbled. I am working on not even stumbling. Do you keep living in sin? I answered your question, will you answer mine?"-God'sUNTruth

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-GodsUNTRuth


"Which you don't do, despite your satanic denials, to the contrary."-John W

"Sell all you have."-John W, as this is one of the "everythings that Jesus says."

Vs.

"Jesus does not tell everyone to do that."-God'sUNtruth

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 05:53 PM
Christ said Himself in Matthew 15:24 "But he answered and said,
I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."

You don't believe Him?

And I, when I am lifted up from the earth, will draw all people to myself."

Jesus came first for those who already belonged to God by faith; not all Jews had faith. It does not take faith to obey someone.

Jesus came first for those who already belonged to God by faith. They were God's, and God gave them to Jesus.

When Jesus was lifted up, crucified, then ALL can come to him to be saved.

Did you read how Jesus says that?

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 05:54 PM
http://www.theologyonline.com/forums...=109122&page=4

Post #60

"I do not sin. I have stumbled. I am working on not even stumbling. Do you keep living in sin? I answered your question, will you answer mine?"-God'sUNTruth

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-GodsUNTRuth


"Which you don't do, despite your satanic denials, to the contrary."-John W

"Sell all you have."-John W, as this is one of the "everythings that Jesus says."

Vs.

"Jesus does not tell everyone to do that."-God'sUNtruth

Obey Jesus, then you will get understanding.

That is what Jesus says.

john w
April 4th, 2015, 06:10 PM
Obey Jesus, then you will get understanding.

That is what Jesus says.

Fine. "Obey Jesus"-He says to sell all you have. Selling all you have is part of the "everything."


__________________________________________________ ___

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-GodsUNTRuth
__________________________________________________ ___

God's Truth
April 4th, 2015, 08:25 PM
Fine. "Obey Jesus"-He says to sell all you have. Selling all you have is part of the "everything."


__________________________________________________ ___

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-GodsUNTRuth
__________________________________________________ ___

If you were to obey Jesus, you would be given understanding.

john w
April 6th, 2015, 10:42 AM
If you were to obey Jesus, you would be given understanding.

Obey Jesus"-He says to sell all you have. Selling all you have is part of the "everything."


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

God's Truth
April 6th, 2015, 11:55 AM
Obey Jesus"-He says to sell all you have. Selling all you have is part of the "everything."


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, [B]exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

Jesus does not tell everyone to sell all they have. Jesus tells that to those who laid the foundation. You would understand Jesus and what he says if you obeyed him.

Jesus says he reveals himself to those who get his teachings and obey them.

John 14:21 The person who has my commandments and obeys them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I will love him and will reveal myself to him."

What is the matter John W.?

SaulToPaul
April 6th, 2015, 01:10 PM
Jesus does not tell everyone to sell all they have. Jesus tells that to those who laid the foundation. You would understand Jesus and what he says if you obeyed him.



So you don't obey all of his teachings, though you said you did.

God's Truth
April 6th, 2015, 01:32 PM
So you don't obey all of his teachings, though you said you did.

I obey everything that Jesus tells us we have to do.

How many times do you have to be told?

SaulToPaul
April 6th, 2015, 01:36 PM
I obey everything that Jesus tells us we have to do.

How many times do you have to be told?

So you don't obey all of his teachings, though you said you did.

john w: "Sell all you have"

john w
April 6th, 2015, 01:42 PM
:banned:
I obey everything that Jesus tells us we have to do.

How many times do you have to be told?

So, you agree that not everything the bible says to do, is directed to everyone?

God's Truth
April 6th, 2015, 01:45 PM
:banned:

So, you agree that not everything the bible says to do, is directed to everyone?

You cannot twist God's Truth, no matter how much you try.

SaulToPaul
April 6th, 2015, 01:48 PM
You cannot twist God's Truth, no matter how much you try.

Another stumper/closer leaving john w speechless...

john w
April 6th, 2015, 02:06 PM
You cannot twist God's Truth, no matter how much you try.

"Untwist" it for me.

So, you agree that not everything the bible says to do, is directed to everyone?

No? Then sell all you have.

republicanchick
April 6th, 2015, 02:42 PM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehe

Hey, I demand to be placed on your list.

only dummies believe that you can offend God egregiously and still live in his absolutely HOLY Presence. too bad you think sin is nothing. God doesnt

You might want to read the Bible

particularly Mt 25:31-46

Mt 18:23

and etc

God's Truth
April 6th, 2015, 03:09 PM
Another stumper/closer leaving john w speechless...

You are so much like John W now that is it almost as if you have his spirit in you.

john w
April 6th, 2015, 03:14 PM
You are so much like John W now that is it almost as if you have his spirit in you.

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 6th, 2015, 03:17 PM
"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

Why are you mocking Jesus?

john w
April 6th, 2015, 03:30 PM
Why are you mocking Jesus?

Why are you "mocking/not obeying Jesus," by not selling all you have, per:


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

?

You:

Silence

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 06:54 AM
Fine. "Obey Jesus"-He says to sell all you have. Selling all you have is part of the "everything."


__________________________________________________ ___

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-GodsUNTRuth
__________________________________________________ ___

dubya,

Jesus was speaking to a man that had claimed that he had done all the things that Jesus said he must do in order to inherit eternal life. Jesus showed him how he had not done it all. The man loved his possessions more than he loved others. (the love of money...)

If a person has truly kept the commandments, that one would know that selling all one has is a simple matter. Nobody who loves God clings to material wealth. Your posts of "then sell all you have" show me that you think money is something to cling to. Your belief seems to be, "trust God but keep your money", it's very obvious from the number of times you use that "sell all you have" zinger.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 10:27 AM
dubya,

Jesus was speaking to a man that had claimed that he had done all the things that Jesus said he must do in order to inherit eternal life. Jesus showed him how he had not done it all. The man loved his possessions more than he loved others. (the love of money...)

If a person has truly kept the commandments, that one would know that selling all one has is a simple matter. Nobody who loves God clings to material wealth. Your posts of "then sell all you have" show me that you think money is something to cling to. Your belief seems to be, "trust God but keep your money", it's very obvious from the number of times you use that "sell all you have" zinger.

You missed it, Mitch. Follow the bouncing ball, his "argument:"


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth


Now, which words are stumping you? "obeying everything that Jesus says. " "all of?"


Be seated.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 10:42 AM
You missed it, Mitch. Follow the bouncing ball, his "argument:"


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth


Now, which words are stumping you? "obeying everything that Jesus says. " "all of?"


Be seated.

He didn't miss it.

He identified you as someone who wants to cling to money.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 10:51 AM
You are so much like John W now that is it almost as if you have his spirit in you.

Nope,

saint john w, the great
STP, the adequate

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 10:51 AM
You missed it, Mitch. Follow the bouncing ball, his "argument:"


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth


Now, which words are stumping you? "obeying everything that Jesus says. " "all of?"


Be seated.

You pick your cherries without pits, don't you? Not only did you take the words "sell all that you have" out of the context of the verses but you even took it out of the sentence within the verse. Slick...

I want nothing to do with you other than to say I am fed up with of you following GT around TOL and chanting "sell all you have". People like you do TOL and Christianity as a whole no favor. I said what I came to say but I guess you can't hear me. You couldn't hear me the last time either.

"blessings" _meshak

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 11:02 AM
You pick your cherries without pits, don't you? Not only did you take the words "sell all that you have" out of the context of the verses but you even took it out of the sentence within the verse. Slick...

I want nothing to do with you other than to say I am fed up with of you following GT around TOL and chanting "sell all you have". People like you do TOL and Christianity as a whole no favor. I said what I came to say but I guess you can't hear me. You couldn't hear me the last time either.

"blessings" _meshak

I am glad that someone else got tired of it, and rebuked him as excellently as you did.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 11:17 AM
I am glad that someone else got tired of it, and rebuked him as excellently as you did.

You still haven't answered john w, as he has you caught in a lie.
Everyone sees it.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 11:31 AM
You still haven't answered john w, as he has you caught in a lie.
Everyone sees it.

She answered him long ago. That's the thing that bugs me.

She said those words are not for everyone and she is right. Those words are for the rich. If you stop picking pitted cherries you could understand the meaning of what was being taught.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 11:40 AM
She said those words are not for everyone and she is right.

But she claims she does ALL that Jesus said to do.

Surely, you can see the contradiction, oh great Hazey Nasheezy?

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 11:51 AM
But she claims she does ALL that Jesus said to do.

Surely, you can see the contradiction, oh great Hazey Nasheezy?

I do everything that Jesus tells me to do.

I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 11:57 AM
I do everything that Jesus tells me to do.

I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God.

So, you do not obey ALL his commands.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:04 PM
I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God.

How much is your mortgage payment in comparison to what you "give to God"?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:04 PM
I am glad that someone else got tired of it, and rebuked him as excellently as you did.

You have much in common with the Muslim Ha Nazir?

Right Divider
April 7th, 2015, 12:12 PM
She answered him long ago. That's the thing that bugs me.

She said those words are not for everyone and she is right. Those words are for the rich. If you stop picking pitted cherries you could understand the meaning of what was being taught.
What NONSENSE!

Only the rich must SELL EVERYTHING?

You're the one that has a CONTEXT problem.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:13 PM
What NONSENSE!

Only the rich must SELL EVERYTHING?

You're the one that has a CONTEXT problem.

Indeed.

:up:

And, rich is a relative term.

Right Divider
April 7th, 2015, 12:15 PM
You have much in common with the Muslim Ha Nazir?
He's now a secret Muslim (changed to other).

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 12:33 PM
So, you do not obey ALL his commands.

You have been told enough times.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 12:36 PM
You have much in common with the Muslim Ha Nazir?

I do not know what all his beliefs are, but he sure rebuked you about what you were doing and your wrong use of scripture.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:37 PM
I do not know what all his beliefs are, but he sure rebuked you about what you were doing and your wrong use of scripture.

I expect a Muslim to compare spiritual things with spiritual from the Holy Bible, don't you?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:39 PM
You have been told enough times.

Yes, you believe that only SOME of the things Jesus said were for you.

Yet, you say you do ALL that Jesus said to do.

You are being dishonest, and need to come clean.

You will feel the relief when you finally do.

DAN P
April 7th, 2015, 12:41 PM
If once saved always saved, then why does Jesus say a person who keeps sinning has NO PERMANENT place in the HOME?

John 8:35 Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.


Hi it is AMUSING that the CONTEXT of John 8:35 ha s nothing to do with OSAS as the context is the Law of Moses , John 8:5 and concerning Jesus earthly Ministry .

#1 , First it talks about the Servant will will not ABIDETH not in the House forever , talking about the Nation of Israel .

#2 , The second one is talking about the SON will ABIDETH/MENO , ABIDETH for ever .

#3, Both are in the Greek Present Tense and Only Jesus will ABIDETH /MENO forever ,

dan p

john w
April 7th, 2015, 12:46 PM
He didn't miss it.

He identified you as someone who wants to cling to money.

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

Nope,per the above:sell all you have, and tell no man that He is the Christ, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, while you show yourself to a Levitical priest.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:49 PM
"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

Nope,per the above:sell all you have, and tell no man that He is the Christ, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, while you show yourself to a Levitical priest.

Reminds me of when Barn had the whole town locked up, and Ange made him let 'em go.

Barn: "But, I had 'em all, dead to rights."

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 12:51 PM
I expect a Muslim to compare spiritual things with spiritual from the Holy Bible, don't you?

I expect someone who professes to be a Christian to not go against me for telling people to obey Jesus. I also expect that person to not follow me around just to put me down and give me neg rep repeatedly and hateful messages.

Everything that Jesus says is to be obeyed. I have tried to help you understand that if you are not a rich man who puts money over God then you do not have to sell all you have. If you are not paralyzed why would you think Jesus wants you to stand up, pick up your mat and walk?

No Christian came to defend me except Ha Nazir. He might not like me or agree with all my beliefs, but he saw people doing wrong to me and did something right.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 12:52 PM
You pick your cherries without pits, don't you? Not only did you take the words "sell all that you have" out of the context of the verses but you even took it out of the sentence within the verse. Slick...

I want nothing to do with you other than to say I am fed up with of you following GT around TOL and chanting "sell all you have". People like you do TOL and Christianity as a whole no favor. I said what I came to say but I guess you can't hear me. You couldn't hear me the last time either.

"blessings" _meshak

I stay on topic, and her "argument:"


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:53 PM
Everything that Jesus says is to be obeyed.

Do you?

Do you neg rep me and leave hateful messages?

john w
April 7th, 2015, 12:55 PM
She answered him long ago. That's the thing that bugs me.

She said those words are not for everyone and she is right. Those words are for the rich. If you stop picking pitted cherries you could understand the meaning of what was being taught.

So, as I asked her:

Do you agree that not all of the commands in the bible, and all of the commands of "Jesus," while he walked the earth, are for everyone's obedience?

She: not a peep.


Thus, sell all you have, per...


"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."”-God’sUNTruth

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 12:57 PM
Do you?

Do you neg rep me and leave hateful messages?

You call yourself a Christian, so you know you are supposed to do to others what you would have others do to you. So I give you neg rep back and put the same message to you as you have given me, just not as often and not as many messages.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 12:59 PM
So I give you neg rep back and put the same message to you

Matthew 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

Matthew 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 12:59 PM
Matthew 5:38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

Matthew 5:39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

Are you admitting you are evil?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:00 PM
Are you admitting you are evil?

Why do you neg rep back? Do you not follow Jesus?

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:02 PM
I do everything that Jesus tells me to do.

I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God.

So, you agree that not all of what "Jesus says" is directed to everyone?


No, you don't agree? Then "Jesus tells you to" sell all you have. Do it. Sell all you have.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:06 PM
Do it. Sell all you have.

For the love of Mike.

Reckon her mortgage payment is more than what she "gives to God"
each month?

Reckon her treasure is where her heart is also?

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:11 PM
So, you agree that not all of what "Jesus says" is directed to everyone?


No, you don't agree? Then "Jesus tells you to" sell all you have. Do it. Sell all you have.

What Jesus says is directed to everyone.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 01:11 PM
He's now a secret Muslim (changed to other).

If the earth swallowed up Mecca in it's entirety I would be dancing in the streets for years. I hate Islam.

Why do you lie about me Christian? Is that what your religion teaches you to do?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:12 PM
What Jesus says is directed to everyone.

Then why don't you do all of it?

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:14 PM
For the love of Mike.

Reckon her mortgage payment is more than what she "gives to God"
each month?

Reckon her treasure is where her heart is also?

I reckon she needs some "miracle salve," Mayor.She's a nut.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:15 PM
What Jesus says is directed to everyone.

Fine. Sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:17 PM
Hi it is AMUSING that the CONTEXT of John 8:35 ha s nothing to do with OSAS as the context is the Law of Moses , John 8:5 and concerning Jesus earthly Ministry .

#1 , First it talks about the Servant will will not ABIDETH not in the House forever , talking about the Nation of Israel .

It is about NOT obeying Jesus.

You can get cut off too if you do not obey.




#2 , The second one is talking about the SON will ABIDETH/MENO , ABIDETH for ever .

That is about obeying Jesus.




#3, Both are in the Greek Present Tense and Only Jesus will ABIDETH /MENO forever ,

dan p

Only those who obey.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:18 PM
What Jesus says is directed to everyone.

Vs.
"I do everything that Jesus tells me to do.

I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God."-you

=do everything "Jesus" says to do, as what He says is directed to everyone, except not everything "Jesus" says to do, is directed to everyone, cuz we do not have to sell all we have, as "everyone" excludes a rich man.


Thanks for checking in. Be seated.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 01:22 PM
What NONSENSE!

Only the rich must SELL EVERYTHING?

You're the one that has a CONTEXT problem.

If I asked you where to find the story of the rich young ruler in the NT, which verses would you give me?

Those words are for anybody that has more than they need (the rich).

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:25 PM
Those words are for anybody that has more than they need (the rich).

Do you have a monthly surplus of income after paying bills?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:26 PM
I am not a rich man. I do not put money over God."-you



Maybe you should get her a few shares of Mayberry Power and Light.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 01:26 PM
I can't understand you Christians that are so against "following Jesus" or "doing what Jesus said".

You believe the man died to pay the price for your sins and you drag Him down instead of raise Him up. You're not even ashamed of that fact. Why don't you just curse Him and be done with it?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:27 PM
I can't understand you Christians that are so against "following Jesus" or "doing what Jesus said".



We aren't.

We are against lying about following him.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:29 PM
What Jesus says is directed to everyone.

Sell all you have, and send me your 401(K) $'s.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:29 PM
I can't understand you Christians that are so against "following Jesus" or "doing what Jesus said".

You believe the man died to pay the price for your sins and you drag Him down instead of raise Him up. You're not even ashamed of that fact. Why don't you just curse Him and be done with it?

I have been debating all kinds of false beliefs and doctrines for years, but the one that surprised me the most is when those calling themselves Christian went against me for saying we have to obey Jesus.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:30 PM
Sell all you have, and send me your 401(K) $'s.

Why do you mock Jesus?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:30 PM
I have been debating all kinds of false beliefs and doctrines for years, but the one that surprised me the most is when those calling themselves Christian went against me for saying we have to obey Jesus.

Why do you say, and not do?

Luke 6:46 (KJV)

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 01:34 PM
Do you have a monthly surplus of income after paying bills?

I don't even count my money anymore. Bills are paid automatically. I have 185K in the bank, a 2010 Corvette Grand Sport with 16k miles on it, a Silverado with 8k miles on it, another 60K in other assets and a 4500 a month income. My bills are usually around 850 a month. I paid cash for everything brand new. I need very little.

I stopped counting how many times I have given it all away after the 6th time. Last year I only gave 20k to those whose need was made known to me. I give only when God says give and only as much as He say to give. He hasn't told me to give anything since last Jan. ($1000). $1000 is chump change.

How about you?

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:36 PM
I don't even count my money anymore. Bills are paid automatically. I have 185K in the bank, a 2010 Corvette Grand Sport with 16k miles on it, a Silverado with 8k miles on it, another 60K in other assets and a 4500 a month income. My bills are usually around 850 a month. I paid cash for everything brand new. I need very little.

I stopped counting how many times I have given it all away after the 6th time. Last year I only gave 20k to those whose need was made known to me. I give only when God says give and only as much as He say to give. He hasn't told me to give anything since last Jan. ($1000)

How about you?


I have a surplus.

If you were a Christian and followed Jesus, would you give all of your surplus away monthly?

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:37 PM
Maybe you should get her a few shares of Mayberry Power and Light.

I shorted "Emmet's Fix It Shop," when Emmit started to focus on dancing too much.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:38 PM
Why do you mock Jesus?

Why don't you quit mocking Jesus, by not obeying everything He says, including selling all you have?

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says…. What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:43 PM
I obey everything that Jesus says.

You malign the truth, mock God, and accuse the brethren.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:45 PM
You malign the truth, mock God, and accuse the brethren.

saint john w silenced again with this zinger...

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:46 PM
Jesus did not speak temporary things and then have Paul carry the government on his shoulders.

This is about Jesus, not Paul

Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 01:47 PM
I have a surplus.

If you were a Christian and followed Jesus, would you give all of your surplus away monthly?

What does being a Christian have to do with it? If God says to I will. Do you even know what HaNazir means? The Nazirite. I made a promise to God (my life and everything I have or will ever get) I have kept that promise for 15 years. I can't tell you how much joy I receive from helping others.

People in the real world think I am Christian. They also warn me about leaving stuff out in the open (thieves) and you should see their faces when I tell them I'm not worried about it. I tell them I gave everything to God, and it's not really my stuff, God just let me use it for a while. I also tell them, I pity the fool that steals from God, they (whoever would steal) must need stuff a lot more than I do.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:50 PM
saint john w silenced again with this zinger...

With your false reasoning, Jesus is not the Lord of the poor who had nothing to give.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:53 PM
God in the flesh was in front of the rich man. What an amazing happening, like no other ever. The rich man did not want to give up his wealth and follow Jesus,

God who was right there in front of him. He did not want to join Jesus’ earthly ministry. We are not all told to leave our homes and give everything away to become traveling ministers. That is nonsense taught by people with no understanding.

Can you imagine Paul preaching to the church of the Ephesians, Galatians, and Corinthians that they had to give away everything they owned and become traveling disciples? There would not be churches in the New Testament for Paul to write too! For the houses of the believers were the churches. No one would be there for Paul to write too and visit, for they would all be gone doing traveling ministries.

Jesus knows everyone’s heart and knew the rich man thought more of his earthly riches than God’s Truth.
Jesus said his teachings are not burdensome, but I am sorry to say you who believe Jesus wants everyone to give away their home and money have made Jesus’ teachings burdensome.

It is not a sin to have money and material possessions. Paul explains that parents save up for their children. How do people save up for their children if they have nothing? Not only that, there are scripture for those who are wealthy in this world, and it is not to give it all away.

1 Timothy 6:17 Command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth, which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God, who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment.
18 Command them to do good, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share.

2 Corinthians 12:14 Now I am ready to visit you for the third time, and I will not be a burden to you, because what I want is not your possessions but you. After all, children should not have to save up for their parents, but parents for their children.

Paul had guidelines for whom Christians were to help. Even a widow had to meet certain guidelines before she would be helped.

1 Timothy 5:9 No widow may be put on the list of widows unless she is over sixty, has been faithful to her husband,

1 Timothy 5:16
If any woman who is a believer has widows in her care, she should continue to help them and not let the church be burdened with them, so that the church can help those widows who are really in need.

1 Timothy 5:4 But if a widow has children or grandchildren, these should learn first of all to put their religion into practice by caring for their own family and so repaying their parents and grandparents, for this is pleasing to God.

How is the Christians wife keeping busy in her house if her house was sold and given to the poor?

Titus 2:5 to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, to be kind, and to be subject to their husbands, so that no one will malign the word of God.

As for Acts 2:45 They sold property and possessions to give to anyone who had need.

The people were not commanded to do this, they wanted to do this.

Read this, it is during the same time:


Ananias and Sapphira

Acts 5:5 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.

3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”


Peter says that the LAND BELONGED TO HIM TO DO WITH IT WHAT HE WANTED. Then, after the LAND was sold---the MONEY from the land was HIS TO DO WHAT HE WANTED WITH IT.

Ananias' sin is not that he kept money, but that he LIED about it.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 01:56 PM
With your false reasoning, Jesus is not the Lord of the poor who had nothing to give.

Do you have a savings account?

john w
April 7th, 2015, 01:57 PM
I have been debating all kinds of false beliefs and doctrines for years, but the one that surprised me the most is when those calling themselves Christian went against me for saying we have to obey Jesus.

Fine-"obey Jesus"-sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 01:59 PM
Do you have a savings account?

None of your business.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:00 PM
I obey everything that Jesus says.
You malign the truth, mock God, and accuse the brethren.

Fine-"Jesus says" to sell all you have. Do it.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 02:00 PM
I have been debating all kinds of false beliefs and doctrines for years, but the one that surprised me the most is when those calling themselves Christian went against me for saying we have to obey Jesus.

They say you can't, it's impossible, and the best of all EXCUSES, "Only one man was perfect". Where I come from we call that "unbelief", if Jesus told people to do it, it must be possible, else Jesus lied.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 02:01 PM
Fine-"Jesus says" to sell all you have. Do it.

If you obeyed Jesus you would have understanding. That is to whom Jesus gives understanding.

steko
April 7th, 2015, 02:04 PM
Jesus did not speak temporary things and then have Paul carry the government on his shoulders.

This is about Jesus, not Paul

Isaiah 9:6 For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Oh yeah, I remember that verse.
Let's see, how does th' rest of that go?
'...upon..?' Oh well, probably doesn't matter.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:05 PM
God in the flesh was in front of the rich man. What an amazing happening, like no other ever. The rich man did not want to give up his wealth and follow Jesus,

God who was right there in front of him. He did not want to join Jesus’ earthly ministry. We are not all told to leave our homes and give everything away to become traveling ministers. That is nonsense taught by people with no understanding.

Can you imagine Paul preaching to the church of the Ephesians, Galatians, and Corinthians that they had to give away everything they owned and become traveling disciples? There would not be churches in the New Testament for Paul to write too! For the houses of the believers were the churches. No one would be there for Paul to write too and visit, for they would all be gone doing traveling ministries.

Jesus knows everyone’s heart and knew the rich man thought more of his earthly riches than God’s Truth.
Jesus said his teachings are not burdensome, but I am sorry to say you who believe Jesus wants everyone to give away their home and money have made Jesus’ teachings burdensome.

It is not a sin to have money and material possessions. Paul explains that parents save up for their children. How do people save up for their children if they have nothing? Not only that, there are scripture for those who are wealthy in this world, and it is not to give it all away.

1 Timothy 6:17 Command those who are rich in this present world not to be arrogant nor to put their hope in wealth, which is so uncertain, but to put their hope in God, who richly provides us with everything for our enjoyment.
18 Command them to do good, to be rich in good deeds, and to be generous and willing to share.

2 Corinthians 12:14 Now I am ready to visit you for the third time, and I will not be a burden to you, because what I want is not your possessions but you. After all, children should not have to save up for their parents, but parents for their children.

Paul had guidelines for whom Christians were to help. Even a widow had to meet certain guidelines before she would be helped.

1 Timothy 5:9 No widow may be put on the list of widows unless she is over sixty, has been faithful to her husband,

1 Timothy 5:16
If any woman who is a believer has widows in her care, she should continue to help them and not let the church be burdened with them, so that the church can help those widows who are really in need.

1 Timothy 5:4 But if a widow has children or grandchildren, these should learn first of all to put their religion into practice by caring for their own family and so repaying their parents and grandparents, for this is pleasing to God.

How is the Christians wife keeping busy in her house if her house was sold and given to the poor?

Titus 2:5 to be self-controlled and pure, to be busy at home, to be kind, and to be subject to their husbands, so that no one will malign the word of God.

As for Acts 2:45 They sold property and possessions to give to anyone who had need.

The people were not commanded to do this, they wanted to do this.

Read this, it is during the same time:


Ananias and Sapphira

Acts 5:5 Now a man named Ananias, together with his wife Sapphira, also sold a piece of property. 2 With his wife’s full knowledge he kept back part of the money for himself, but brought the rest and put it at the apostles’ feet.

3 Then Peter said, “Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you have lied to the Holy Spirit and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land? 4 Didn’t it belong to you before it was sold? And after it was sold, wasn’t the money at your disposal? What made you think of doing such a thing? You have not lied just to human beings but to God.”


Peter says that the LAND BELONGED TO HIM TO DO WITH IT WHAT HE WANTED. Then, after the LAND was sold---the MONEY from the land was HIS TO DO WHAT HE WANTED WITH IT.

Ananias' sin is not that he kept money, but that he LIED about it.

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says…. What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth




Luke 18:22 KJV

Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.


Sell all you have, per the above.

And show yourself to a Levitical priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, as "What Jesus says is directed to everyone," according to you.



Matthew 8:4 KJV And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 02:07 PM
If you obeyed Jesus you would have understanding. That is to whom Jesus gives understanding.

john w shut down again...

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 02:09 PM
Oh yeah, I remember that verse.
Let's see, how does th' rest of that go?
'...upon..?' Oh well, probably doesn't matter.

It does not matter if you say on.

It does not matter one bit.

SaulToPaul
April 7th, 2015, 02:10 PM
Sell all you have, per the above.

If I was the little flock, saint john w, and was heading for the tribulation, I'd sell every last thing I own.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:11 PM
If you obeyed Jesus you would have understanding. That is to whom Jesus gives understanding.

Nope:

"What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth


Sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 02:11 PM
"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says…. What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth




Luke 18:22 KJV

Now when Jesus heard these things, he said unto him, Yet lackest thou one thing: sell all that thou hast, and distribute unto the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, follow me.


Sell all you have, per the above.

And show yourself to a Levitical priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, as "What Jesus says is directed to everyone," according to you.



Matthew 8:4 KJV And Jesus saith unto him, See thou tell no man; but go thy way, shew thyself to the priest, and offer the gift that Moses commanded, for a testimony unto them.

Go obey Jesus and get some knowledge, then come back and debate me.

See John 7:17.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:12 PM
If you obeyed Jesus you would have understanding. That is to whom Jesus gives understanding.

Nope:

"We always have to obey Jesus."-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:13 PM
If you obeyed Jesus you would have understanding. That is to whom Jesus gives understanding.

Nope-the "Trifecta:"

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 02:15 PM
Nope-the "Trifecta:"

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-God’sUNTruth

All you have is worthless opinions because Jesus says you will have knowledge if you do what he says. You do not do what he says, so you have worthless opinions.

See John 7:17.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:16 PM
Go obey Jesus and get some knowledge, then come back and debate me.

See John 7:17.

Nope:

"What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 02:17 PM
Nope:

"What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

Sell all you have.

Go obey Jesus and get some knowledge, then come back and debate me.

See John 7:17.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:18 PM
All you have is worthless opinions because Jesus says you will have knowledge if you do what he says. You do not do what he says, so you have worthless opinions.

See John 7:17.

"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-God’sUNTruth

"if you do what he says"-God’sUNTruth

"do what he says-Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says"-sell all you have. Do it.

john w
April 7th, 2015, 02:20 PM
Go obey Jesus and get some knowledge, then come back and debate me.

See John 7:17.

"Jesus' words are for everyone."-God’sUNTruth

"Jesus' words are" sell all you have, since you are one of the "everyone"'s. Do it.

Ha Nazir
April 7th, 2015, 05:29 PM
I expect someone who professes to be a Christian to not go against me for telling people to obey Jesus. I also expect that person to not follow me around just to put me down and give me neg rep repeatedly and hateful messages.

Everything that Jesus says is to be obeyed. I have tried to help you understand that if you are not a rich man who puts money over God then you do not have to sell all you have. If you are not paralyzed why would you think Jesus wants you to stand up, pick up your mat and walk?

No Christian came to defend me except Ha Nazir. He might not like me or agree with all my beliefs, but he saw people doing wrong to me and did something right.

I'm not Christian.

I don't have any idea how long this debate with you and the MADists has been going on, probably years. It's juvenile and not in your best interests.

Sow your seed where you will, but don't waste time watering the road. If the seed you sow won't grow anywhere, check with your supplier. Good seed will always grow on fertile ground but has little chance elsewhere.

republicanchick
April 7th, 2015, 05:54 PM
"Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says."-God’sUNTruth

"if you do what he says"-God’sUNTruth

"do what he says-Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says"-sell all you have. Do it.

you don't do what he says

you don't love your neighbor (Republicanchick) like yourself

john w
April 7th, 2015, 06:14 PM
you don't do what he says

you don't love your neighbor (Republicanchick) like yourself

I agree that I do not do everything that the Lord Jesus Christ commanded, while He was on earth,for He taught the law, and I am not uner the law. That is how an honest person speaks on this subject. But then again, you, and the rest of you Roman Catholics, aren't honest.

And get this straight: love your neighbor like yourself... is straight out of the law, and there is only one person that ever met that requirement. Guess who?

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 06:58 PM
I'm not Christian.
I did not mean for anyone to think that I thought you were Christian. They said you were a Muslim.


I don't have any idea how long this debate with you and the MADists has been going on, probably years. It's juvenile and not in your best interests.
God blesses me for it.



Sow your seed where you will, but don't waste time watering the road. If the seed you sow won't grow anywhere, check with your supplier. Good seed will always grow on fertile ground but has little chance elsewhere.

Someone might read what I write and get some good from it, if not now maybe later.

steko
April 7th, 2015, 07:28 PM
It does not matter if you say on.

It does not matter one bit.

OH...it matter!

Right Divider
April 7th, 2015, 07:34 PM
you don't do what he says

you don't love your neighbor (Republicanchick) like yourself
I love you enough to be honest and tell you that you post some of the dumbest stuff on TOL.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 07:37 PM
OH...it matter!

2 Timothy 2:14 Keep reminding God's people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.

Right Divider
April 7th, 2015, 07:39 PM
2 Timothy 2:14 Keep reminding God's people of these things. Warn them before God against quarreling about words; it is of no value, and only ruins those who listen.
Yes, I believe that was Paul talking about you.

God's Truth
April 7th, 2015, 07:49 PM
Yes, I believe that was Paul talking about you.

Prove it.

Tambora
April 8th, 2015, 07:48 AM
OH...it matter!
It shore do.

heir
April 8th, 2015, 07:59 AM
you don't do what he says

you don't love your neighbor (Republicanchick) like yourself

Love worketh no ill to his neighbor. The deceitful workers of your church are not loving you or anyone else when they refuse to preach the gospel of Christ as the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth (Romans 1:16-17 KJV, 1 Corinthians 15: 1-4 KJV).

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 08:48 AM
To defend your doctrines, you make Paul a blasphemer of the Holy Spirit, and Jesus change his mind about what he said about if anyone...

To defend your doctrines, you have to argue with words like upon and on, even though Paul warns you not to argue about words that do not matter.

To defend your doctrines, you have to constantly accuse me of sins that I do not do.

Can't you see something is wrong with all that?

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2015, 09:56 AM
To defend your doctrines, you make Paul a blasphemer of the Holy Spirit, and Jesus change his mind about what he said about if anyone...

To defend your doctrines, you have to argue with words like upon and on, even though Paul warns you not to argue about words that do not matter.

To defend your doctrines, you have to constantly accuse me of sins that I do not do.

Can't you see something is wrong with all that?

If you are devoting your entire life to trying to get into a church you cannot get into, wouldn't you want to know?

Like Paul, there is only one church that you qualify to enter. No good works can get you into it, no good works can keep you in it.
Paul had done nothing good, he had only persecuted men full of the Holy Ghost. He entered by belief.

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2015, 10:00 AM
To defend your doctrines, you have to argue with words like upon and on, even though Paul warns you not to argue about words that do not matter.



All words, that the Holy Spirit took the time to inspire, matter.

Would you rather walk by a fire, or walk through a fire?

Would you rather jump on a cliff, or jump off a cliff?

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2015, 10:06 AM
To defend your doctrines, you have to constantly accuse me of sins that I do not do.



We don't have to accuse. Sin dwells in your body and it comes out daily. You do not walk daily as the LORD Jesus walked.

The same is true of all of us.

You would do well to just fess up, swallow your pride, and come clean.

Perhaps then you would see your need to believe 1 Cor 15:1-4 (KJV) and trust the LORD completely, once and for all.

steko
April 8th, 2015, 10:19 AM
To defend your doctrines, you have to argue with words like upon and on, even though Paul warns you not to argue about words that do not matter.



You quoted:

Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

....which is a partial quote according to the context.

So, I quoted one word from the next verse, 'upon', to emphasize the fact that the government referred to in vs 6 has a specific location and context.

Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.


But....according to you and your misinterpretation of Paul.......words don't matter.

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 10:33 AM
If you are devoting your entire life to trying to get into a church you cannot get into, wouldn't you want to know?

Like Paul, there is only one church that you qualify to enter. No good works can get you into it, no good works can keep you in it.
Paul had done nothing good, he had only persecuted men full of the Holy Ghost. He entered by belief.

More proof that in order to defend your doctrines you have to do wrong, such as constantly put me down and insult.

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 10:36 AM
All words, that the Holy Spirit took the time to inspire, matter.

Would you rather walk by a fire, or walk through a fire?

Would you rather jump on a cliff, or jump off a cliff?

You are not using examples equivalent to what steko and I were discussing.

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 10:37 AM
We don't have to accuse. Sin dwells in your body and it comes out daily. You do not walk daily as the LORD Jesus walked.

The same is true of all of us.

You would do well to just fess up, swallow your pride, and come clean.

Perhaps then you would see your need to believe 1 Cor 15:1-4 (KJV) and trust the LORD completely, once and for all.

Don't you know that Satan is the accuser of the brethren, and that you accuse me of things just to go against me when I tell people to obey Jesus?

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 10:38 AM
You quoted:

Isa 9:6 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.

....which is a partial quote according to the context.

So, I quoted one word from the next verse, 'upon', to emphasize the fact that the government referred to in vs 6 has a specific location and context.

Isa 9:7 Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this.


But....according to you and your misinterpretation of Paul.......words don't matter.

You haven't proved anything except that you argue about words that do not matter.

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2015, 10:47 AM
Don't you know that Satan is the accuser of the brethren, and that you accuse me of things just to go against me when I tell people to obey Jesus?

Sin dwells in you and comes out daily.
You know it, I know it, the LORD knows it, everyone knows it.

john w
April 8th, 2015, 11:31 AM
You haven't proved anything except that you argue about words that do not matter.


Like these "words that do not matter:"

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says…. What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

God's Truth
April 8th, 2015, 11:36 AM
Sin dwells in you and comes out daily.
You know it, I know it, the LORD knows it, everyone knows it.

You cannot stop yourself can you?

SaulToPaul
April 8th, 2015, 01:19 PM
Like these "words that do not matter:"

"Everything Jesus says stands forever…. Jesus' words are for everyone.....We always have to obey God ...We always have to obey Jesus….........I obey all of Jesus' teachings....I follow all of Jesus teachings, exactly as he says…..Faith is obeying everything that Jesus says…. What Jesus says is directed to everyone.”-God’sUNTruth

She has a stretching the truth compelsion.

john w
April 8th, 2015, 01:35 PM
She has a stretching the truth compelsion.

And I was going to invite her, to be an "Esquire Club" member, and perhaps one of my Latex salesman. But she's too moody, like gypsies, and selfish, like giraffes, as she won't "obey Jesus," and sell all that she has.

SaulToPaul
April 9th, 2015, 09:29 AM
And I was going to invite her, to be an "Esquire Club" member, and perhaps one of my Latex salesman. But she's too moody, like gypsies, and selfish, like giraffes, as she won't "obey Jesus," and sell all that she has.

She wouldn't fit in at the Esquire Club with Roger Courtney. As you know, saint john w the great, the LORD never commanded anyone to play golf or teach how to get "higher" golf scores.

john w
April 9th, 2015, 11:55 AM
She wouldn't fit in at the Esquire Club with Roger Courtney. As you know, saint john w the great, the LORD never commanded anyone to play golf or teach how to get "higher" golf scores.

You kidder, you! I might just buy you a coin, where the buffalo head faces the other way.

oatmeal
April 9th, 2015, 01:28 PM
That is works salvation. Very similar to Rome.

Bible states clearly. All are unrighteous, all are incapable to do good.
To "accept free gift" is asking someone to do good. But the Scriptures says that is impossible.

Unrighteous = incapable of doing good?


To "accept free gift" = asking someone to do good?



But the Scriptures says that is impossible.

Where does it say that is impossible?

Romans 3:22-26

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

26 To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Our works cannot earn the free gift of salvation that Jesus Christ earned for us.

That is where salvation is not of work, but by grace.

But it does take our effort to receive the gift, Roman 10:9-10 takes a little bit of work to understand and do.

But that work does not earn our salvation, it is how we receive the gift of salvation

oatmeal
April 9th, 2015, 01:46 PM
what about the 'if'

By which also ye are dsaved, if ye ||keep in memory †what I preached unto you,

That is a very good question.

I have not seen a satisfactory answer posted.

I Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV

Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

The Phillips NT answers some of you concerns.

1 Corinthians 15:1-8J.B. Phillips New Testament (PHILLIPS)

A reminder of the gospel message: the resurrection is an integral part of our faith
15 1-2 Now, my brothers, I want to speak about the Gospel which I have previously preached to you, which you accepted, in which you are at present standing, and by which, if you remain faithful to the message I gave you, your salvation is being worked out—unless, of course, your faith had no meaning behind it at all.

3-8 For I passed on to you Corinthians first of all the message I had myself received—that Christ died for our sins, as the scriptures said he would; that he was buried and rose again on the third day, again as the scriptures foretold. He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve, and subsequently he was seen simultaneously by over five hundred Christians, of whom the majority are still alive, though some have since died. He was then seen by James, then by all the messengers. And last of all, as if to one born abnormally late, he appeared to me!

We did Romans 10:9-10 to receive salvation.

That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

Half of the prerequisites to receive salvation deals with God having raised Jesus Christ from the dead.

there are two foundational truths that we must do to receive the gift of salvation.

1. Confess with the mouth the lord Jesus

2. Believe in our heart that God raised him from the dead.

Once we have done that God gives us the gift of salvation, we are saved.

But should we discard those truths now that we are saved?

God forbid.

We must learn to keep Jesus lord in our lives Ephesians 1:1 "faithful in Christ Jesus "

and

we must continue to believe in that love and power that God used to raise Jesus Christ from the dead. Ephesians 1:19-20

You ever heard the expression, "God gave you brains, now use it!"

God gave us salvation, we are to use it.

How?

Basically, by continuing in the two truths that we did to receive salvation.

We are to work out, or energize our salvation so it does us and others good right now in this life. Philippians 2:12-13

We are not to receive the gift of salvation and not open it up.

We are to find out what it is, what we can and are supposed to do with now and live it. I John 5:13

Christians have enormous and powerful potential, if we only learn to use it.

Colossians 1:27 "Christ in you"

John 14:12 Same works as Jesus Christ and greater works

We are not to sit on this salvation, we are to live powerfully to glorify God because that is God's intent for those who chose to receive the gift.

Ephesians 2:8-10

oatmeal
April 9th, 2015, 01:50 PM
I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

makes no sense. We all know the Bible to one extent or another.. It is people's (faulty) interpretations that need attn.


+

It is equally irritating when someone "proclaims the gospel" without scripture references.

Why should I believe that their "gospel" is anything but their own opinion, what they wish the scriptures taught

God's Truth
April 9th, 2015, 02:36 PM
She wouldn't fit in at the Esquire Club with Roger Courtney. As you know, saint john w the great, the LORD never commanded anyone to play golf or teach how to get "higher" golf scores.
This Psalm comes to mind...

Psalm 84:10 Better is one day in your courts than a thousand elsewhere; I would rather be a doorkeeper in the house of my God than dwell in the tents of the wicked.

heir
April 9th, 2015, 03:30 PM
I hate when people quote the Bible and say nothing else

makes no sense.
1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

heir
April 9th, 2015, 03:33 PM
It is equally irritating when someone "proclaims the gospel" without scripture references.1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV

intojoy
October 6th, 2015, 01:18 AM
B57. Because he got saved before he believed. He was always righteous

meshak
October 6th, 2015, 06:43 AM
Eternal life is the free gift of God.
Redemption is not free as Messiah paid for it.
Obedience to God is that we believe the Father is well pleased with the Son, God is indeed well pleased with the redemption purchased by Messiah and we who believe are united to God thru the Messiah. Those who reject the peace of God made thru redemption (that was not free) will be punished for their sins. I can never be punished for my sins, God punished Messiah in my place and set me free from guilt and condemnation.

You are perverting Jesus' teachings. You speak against His word.

Jesus repeats clearly to be faithful to Him until the end. Accepting Jesus is not one time confession.

You have to omit or disregard many of Jesus' word to justify your claim.

Grosnick Marowbe
October 6th, 2015, 09:42 AM
You are perverting Jesus' teachings. You speak against His word.

Jesus repeats clearly to be faithful to Him until the end. Accepting Jesus is not one time confession.

You have to omit or disregard many of Jesus' word to justify your claim.

Have a nice day. Make another friend along your way. Look around
your city, and throw that silly hat in the bay.

intojoy
November 15th, 2015, 07:01 PM
how utterly and deplorably ABSURD

you will never get grace in your soul if you don't DO good things. And again, if humans do not do good deeds, they do evil ones... b/c it is evil to NOT do certain things: feed the hungry (Mt 25:31), comfort the afflicted/oppressed/lonely... etc..

you osasers need to read the Bible

Mt 25:31 says that those who do not feed the hungry, comfort the lonely, etc... "will go off to ETERNAL punishment" [emphasis added]


then there is Mt 18:23 (Purgatory... punishment that eventually ends...)

and a whole lot of others..



+++

Not saved yet?

republicanchick
November 17th, 2015, 04:04 PM
Isn't it amusing how the OSAS believers do not bicker amongst themselves?

And isn't amusing how the nutters are drawn to the lose it group?

I've noticed that they who teach salvation can be given back or lost do to some sin, these kooks always wind up fighting with each other.

Here's a start list to vote on who you think is the most holy.

Meshak

Jason

CS Guy

Cross Ref

Sorry I forgot who else is against grace...help me out with the list and then we can crown a victor. Hehe

really disappointed i wasn't on the list..

you CAN lose salvation... the Bible backs this up.. .

Not all who say Lord, Lord will not make it, as Jesus says... Who says Lord, Lord but Christians? and a few Jews... but in any case...

in Revelation it speaks of having your name blotted out of the Book of Life...

and I could go on and on and on..... (with Bible psgs)




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